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Author: Subject: Duanes influence on clapton after D&tD

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  posted on 2/7/2009 at 10:52 PM
hey you know like the dominoes live show in philly where Eric plays alot of slide...let me get the date.Oct. 16th.they do Ramblin on my mind and the earliest version of motherless children(By him) that i have heard...


but my point is directed more to the album Eric produced with Tommy Dowd ATCO "buddy guy and Jr. wells play the blues"when rhino released the extended two disc set i held my breath hoping there would be Duane on it..as they recorded it at Critria in OCT. 1970!!!!! so right at the time they were wrapping up Layla.....unfortunately duane is not on it..but the other Dominoes play on a track or two.....and Eric plays....you guessed it...SLIDE...and i know eric played slide before he met Duane..my point is he began exploring it more after his encounter with Duane...listen to 461 ocean Blvd. and the outtakes,,,and the slide on this..especially the bonus disc "last night"


also i am a fan of hoodoo man blues by guy and wells as Duane mentions them in a live show..but this album with Dowd and Clapton producing is a MONSTER......I mean just really like an essential blues MONSTER....every instrument is on the $$$$$ bigtime....if you guys are fans of Dowd..give it a spin....

 
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  posted on 2/8/2009 at 12:43 AM
quote:
hey you know like the dominoes live show in philly where Eric plays alot of slide...let me get the date.Oct. 16th.they do Ramblin on my mind and the earliest version of motherless children(By him) that i have heard...


but my point is directed more to the album Eric produced with Tommy Dowd ATCO "buddy guy and Jr. wells play the blues"when rhino released the extended two disc set i held my breath hoping there would be Duane on it..as they recorded it at Critria in OCT. 1970!!!!! so right at the time they were wrapping up Layla.....unfortunately duane is not on it..but the other Dominoes play on a track or two.....and Eric plays....you guessed it...SLIDE...and i know eric played slide before he met Duane..my point is he began exploring it more after his encounter with Duane...listen to 461 ocean Blvd. and the outtakes,,,and the slide on this..especially the bonus disc "last night"


also i am a fan of hoodoo man blues by guy and wells as Duane mentions them in a live show..but this album with Dowd and Clapton producing is a MONSTER......I mean just really like an essential blues MONSTER....every instrument is on the $$$$$ bigtime....if you guys are fans of Dowd..give it a spin....


Clapton plays more slide on Live At The Fillmore than I've ever heard him play befoe or since...especially on Tell The Truth.

 

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  posted on 2/8/2009 at 03:08 AM
quote:
quote:
hey you know like the dominoes live show in philly where Eric plays alot of slide...let me get the date.Oct. 16th.they do Ramblin on my mind and the earliest version of motherless children(By him) that i have heard...


but my point is directed more to the album Eric produced with Tommy Dowd ATCO "buddy guy and Jr. wells play the blues"when rhino released the extended two disc set i held my breath hoping there would be Duane on it..as they recorded it at Critria in OCT. 1970!!!!! so right at the time they were wrapping up Layla.....unfortunately duane is not on it..but the other Dominoes play on a track or two.....and Eric plays....you guessed it...SLIDE...and i know eric played slide before he met Duane..my point is he began exploring it more after his encounter with Duane...listen to 461 ocean Blvd. and the outtakes,,,and the slide on this..especially the bonus disc "last night"


also i am a fan of hoodoo man blues by guy and wells as Duane mentions them in a live show..but this album with Dowd and Clapton producing is a MONSTER......I mean just really like an essential blues MONSTER....every instrument is on the $$$$$ bigtime....if you guys are fans of Dowd..give it a spin....


Clapton plays more slide on Live At The Fillmore than I've ever heard him play befoe or since...especially on Tell The Truth.


As Rich mentioned, you're able to listen to Eric's slide play on "Tell The Truth" at many Dominos shows which were recorded privately.
I recommend to listen to Marquee Club live show, from their first UK leg, 1970-08-11. You'll will be amazed by "Tell The Truth" from this show.
Also it's funny that "Anyday" from Layla album, Duane played finger licks on left channel and most of the slide play was by Eric on right channel.


 

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  posted on 2/8/2009 at 01:18 PM
I have that marquee show i will thorw it on...the fillmore shows were end of Oct. right?? So do you guys think ithe premise holds water....I also knew about anyday..and maybe you guys will not dig this but I heard that Quote where duane says something about a chariot race was in reference to WDLGTBSS and not anyday...but you know how that goes 40 years and a whole lot of hard living(clean or otherwise)memories weave rich fabric..yeah yeah i got the marquee show in fast version of tell the truth..


so what are we saying that he was leaning that way anyway or that Duane did influence him to play bottleneck more???

PS masashiko you did a SMOKIN job on the dec1st remaster ...thanks!!!!!!!!

[Edited on 2/8/2009 by shane-o]

 

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  posted on 2/8/2009 at 01:54 PM
Masahiko wrote:
"Also it's funny that "Anyday" from Layla album, Duane played finger licks on left channel and most of the slide play was by Eric on right channel."

Masahiko-san, are you sure about that. It is Eric on the left and Duane on the right. Clapton plays the individual notes on slide, while Duane plays chords on the right. The Poe book or the Layla book says that as well, but it might be in error.

How are you doing these days, old friend? Is the health good?

Cheers

Carlos

 

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  posted on 2/8/2009 at 07:11 PM
quote:
I have that marquee show i will thorw it on...the fillmore shows were end of Oct. right?? So do you guys think ithe premise holds water....I also knew about anyday..and maybe you guys will not dig this but I heard that Quote where duane says something about a chariot race was in reference to WDLGTBSS and not anyday...but you know how that goes 40 years and a whole lot of hard living(clean or otherwise)memories weave rich fabric..yeah yeah i got the marquee show in fast version of tell the truth..


so what are we saying that he was leaning that way anyway or that Duane did influence him to play bottleneck more???

PS masashiko you did a SMOKIN job on the dec1st remaster ...thanks!!!!!!!!

[Edited on 2/8/2009 by shane-o]


Thank you for your kind words for my work, Dominos Tampa show 12/01/'70, and glad top hear you've enjoyed it.

My post was less words, and I don't think there're no influences of Duane on Eric's slide play.
When I heard to "Please Be With Me" of "461 Ocean Boulevard", I felt a huge influences of Duane on Eric's slide play. I know he loves Duane's play even if he thought Duane's way of slide play is not correct way when he met Duane first.

 

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  posted on 2/8/2009 at 07:28 PM
quote:
Masahiko wrote:
"Also it's funny that "Anyday" from Layla album, Duane played finger licks on left channel and most of the slide play was by Eric on right channel."

Masahiko-san, are you sure about that. It is Eric on the left and Duane on the right. Clapton plays the individual notes on slide, while Duane plays chords on the right. The Poe book or the Layla book says that as well, but it might be in error.

How are you doing these days, old friend? Is the health good?

Cheers

Carlos


Hello Carlos!
Hope you're keeping well and I'm fine too.

I have both books you mentioned but it's a little bit hard to me to read all the ariticles in English. (LOL) So I don't know well what they wrote about Anyday.
When I first listened to this song, it was over 33 years ago, I couldn't recognize which guitar play is Erc and Duane. However, I'm sure now, left channel is Duane and right channel is Eric, if my speaker connection to amplifier is not wrong.
You didn't mentioned about whole solo play and single note licks on this song but I think you're thinking it's Duane's play, right?
The slide plays of chord progression (right channel) is Eric, not Duane. They are much more thinner sound than Duane's tone and I think they are from the character of Eric's guitar, Fender Stratocaster.
In the honest, Anyday is my most favorite song on Layla album, I really love this song with Dunae's fantastic and lyrical play.


 

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  posted on 2/9/2009 at 12:19 PM
When Derek was touring with EC, couldn't help but think back to the Howlin' Wolf London Sessions, where Clapton talked Wolf into playing guitar on Little Red Rooster.
Asking for help, showing respect.

Always wondered what the conversations were like between Derek and EC, as Clapton was persuaded to go deep into the Layla material again. I bet that if anybody knows how to get Eric to delve into slide again, that Derek knows the right words. The kid has been such a blessing in so many ways.

 
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  posted on 2/9/2009 at 12:42 PM
Duane's playing on this song brings tears to my eyes. My favorite as well.
 

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  posted on 2/9/2009 at 03:22 PM
yeah Mahashiko...I have alot of versions of the Dec 1stTampa show..starting with Soulmate 1 and soulmates2 and soulmates twinflames..live at tampa, pink roberts live at tampa, the in the skydog ARMS release and now your remaster...and your remaster is the best so far......I can actually hear alot of Duane .....or alot more...i



do not know if the taper was sitting on erics side of the stage or what but yours is great,I tried everything to hear Duane more in the long WHY DOES LOVE GOT TO BE SO SAD as that just is thee best....I could listen to them Eric and Duane (or Eric and derek for that matter) do that Bmaj7 to E maj7 ending at whole and half time all day long....I think Duane may have broke a string near the end as all i hear is eric from about 7:47 or so on...regardless Carl Radle and Jim gordon cook on those live versions and this night was no exception..what did they call Gordon.."the human metronome..."there is tuning before and after the song...."


I think I heard or read somewhere that Duane broke 3 strings that night....

 

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  posted on 2/9/2009 at 10:22 PM
i remember reading it was very hot and humid night....
lots of broken strings and even more difficult to keep them in tune....

 

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  posted on 2/10/2009 at 02:42 AM
Nope. Wasn't me who wrote about who played which part on "Anyday." I blathered on for several pages about "Layla," but I didn't go into any detail about "Anyday."

As far as "Please Be With Me" is concerned, Scott Boyer told me that Eric wanted to do a tribute to Duane on the 461 Ocean Boulevard album, but he wanted to be subtle about it, so that's the song he chose.

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  posted on 2/10/2009 at 12:37 PM
Hello Randy, and Masahiko, I might be wrong here

re: Anyday, if Whitlock is to be believed, then that is Duane on the right side, doing the "chariot race" slide at the beginning. Since the live version done months earlier has no slide it presents a contrast. I read, perhaps in error, that Duane had the slide chords on the right, and Clapton was doing the single notes on the left.

In addition, is Clapton's voice not central left while Whitlock is central right? And, there are a couple of rhythm guitars on the right that sound more like a Les Paul, particular on the "chuka chuka" parts. Duane was one hell of a rhythm guitarist, and one does not think of Clapton as a rhythm type player.

Finally, the slider on the right seems to have far more control over the slide than does the slider on the left. But somewhere there is a discussion on the parts. Though I might be in error, the left side has more of a Fender sound....I have to check the charts to see it again.

If you listen to the rhythm guitars on the right between the two versions in the middle of the song...where they do Anyday, Anyday, twice, and Clapton yells waaahh you can hear two distinct rhythm guitars. By the way, isnt that Clapton on the left side playing the recurring "bass" note heard throughout the song, even when Radle is thumping away?

Anyway, I suspect the recording was designed to create one combined sound that would have us wondering.

Finally, I have been re-reading the English version of Nizami's Majnun and Layla, and surmise that Clapton and Whitlock also drew upon the Layla story....the reference to break the glass seems the likely culprit, as one can find numerous references to wine glasses and broken wine glasses. In addition, Layla is married to another man, and refuses to sleep with her husband in order to remain "pure" for Majnun. Finally, Majnun writes all of the poetry to Layla in order to prove his love for her, and secretly watches her from a distance to catch her smile. I know, I know deconstruction, but at age 25, on drugs, madly in love, who doesn't remember grabbing at any audio or visual tool to win your love over

OK, where are all the Fender and Gibson players? Can you tell the two apart?

Cheers

Carlos

 

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  posted on 2/10/2009 at 06:54 PM
quote:
Hello Randy, and Masahiko, I might be wrong here

re: Anyday, if Whitlock is to be believed, then that is Duane on the right side, doing the "chariot race" slide at the beginning. Since the live version done months earlier has no slide it presents a contrast. I read, perhaps in error, that Duane had the slide chords on the right, and Clapton was doing the single notes on the left.

In addition, is Clapton's voice not central left while Whitlock is central right? And, there are a couple of rhythm guitars on the right that sound more like a Les Paul, particular on the "chuka chuka" parts. Duane was one hell of a rhythm guitarist, and one does not think of Clapton as a rhythm type player.

Finally, the slider on the right seems to have far more control over the slide than does the slider on the left. But somewhere there is a discussion on the parts. Though I might be in error, the left side has more of a Fender sound....I have to check the charts to see it again.

If you listen to the rhythm guitars on the right between the two versions in the middle of the song...where they do Anyday, Anyday, twice, and Clapton yells waaahh you can hear two distinct rhythm guitars. By the way, isnt that Clapton on the left side playing the recurring "bass" note heard throughout the song, even when Radle is thumping away?

Anyway, I suspect the recording was designed to create one combined sound that would have us wondering.

Finally, I have been re-reading the English version of Nizami's Majnun and Layla, and surmise that Clapton and Whitlock also drew upon the Layla story....the reference to break the glass seems the likely culprit, as one can find numerous references to wine glasses and broken wine glasses. In addition, Layla is married to another man, and refuses to sleep with her husband in order to remain "pure" for Majnun. Finally, Majnun writes all of the poetry to Layla in order to prove his love for her, and secretly watches her from a distance to catch her smile. I know, I know deconstruction, but at age 25, on drugs, madly in love, who doesn't remember grabbing at any audio or visual tool to win your love over

OK, where are all the Fender and Gibson players? Can you tell the two apart?

Cheers

Carlos


I'm not a player, but I can easily tell the difference between a Gibson and a Fender.....in addition, Clapton's phrasings are very different from Duane's. EC has a tendency to group notes differently than DA. To me, Duane's Gibson stands out much more prominently than EC's Strat does on Layla....the entire record, that is....as well as the song.

And on the Curtis Hixon Hall show Duane's guitar is MUCH higher ikn the mix....I have the Soul Mates boot, haven't heard Masahiko's remaster yet.

 

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  posted on 2/10/2009 at 08:17 PM
I'd be happy to point them out but we would have to be in the same room listening at the same time

[Edited on 2/11/2009 by PeachNutt]

 

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  posted on 2/11/2009 at 05:35 AM
Carlos,

Now I'm checking again "Anyday" with reading your explanation.
I don't know what Bobby has said for "Anyday" but at beginning of this song, slide play and Hammond can be heard on right channel and single notes riff is on left side. This slide play on right channel is not Duane, and left channel's single notes passage is Duane.
Next, the song is being quiet, before Eric's vocal starting, Duane on left side is playing only single note repeatedly. Slide notes are heard on right channel, this is really hard to recognize who is playing but from the sound, I think it's Stratocaster, not Les Paul, at least this guitar uses two pickups mixing.
The repeated single note play continues while Eric is singing before chorus part (refrain part?).
Whilst of prior chorus part, slide play can be heard on left channel, this is absolutely Duane, no doubt. Also slide guitar playing chords can be heard on right channel, this was done by Eric.
Getting into after part of chorus, singing "And I know anyday, anyday, I will see you smile", Duane plays on left channel clearly. There's a slide plays on right channel also but it"s Eric's play.
And Of course, solo play next to second chorus is Duane. Really fantastic!!!

As you know, Stratocaster uses single coil pickups and Les Paul standard 1958 or so is using Humbacking pickups. Basically, Les Paul sounds more fatty and loud than Stratocaster.

These are only my opinion but I believe it's not wrong so much.

Masahiko

 

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  posted on 2/11/2009 at 08:52 AM
since reading this thread, I've been listening to the Layla album intently, trying to figure it all out.
my own feeling is that Duane's tone is "richer" - in a way it's nice to have the 1st 3 tunes (Eric only) for comparison. Even still, sometimes it's hard to figure out who is playing what (for me, anyway)
I'm thoroughly enjoying my "homeowork project" - thanks

 

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  posted on 2/12/2009 at 12:13 PM
The fantastic slide dobro playing on Let It Grow, from 461OcnBlvd, is quite reminiscent of Duane's playing -- have always thought Eric had Duane in mind on that one, whether consciously or subconsciously

 

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  posted on 3/4/2009 at 10:12 AM
quote:
When Derek was touring with EC, couldn't help but think back to the Howlin' Wolf London Sessions, where Clapton talked Wolf into playing guitar on Little Red Rooster.
Asking for help, showing respect.

Always wondered what the conversations were like between Derek and EC, as Clapton was persuaded to go deep into the Layla material again. I bet that if anybody knows how to get Eric to delve into slide again, that Derek knows the right words. The kid has been such a blessing in so many ways.


In his All About Jazz interview last week Derek mentioned Duane a lot, including this about Clapton and Duane:

quote:
While we were on the road he was in the process of writing his book too, so he was very much in the process of digging that stuff up. Even to the point where I felt he was trying to get insight into the whole Duane Allman Brothers camp from me, so it would just kind of spark memories and spark his recollection of Duane and that time. I could tell that that time left a big mark on him; I think because he got that close with Duane right before he passed, that was a huge part of his life.


http://www.allaboutjazz.com/php/article.php?id=31943

 

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  posted on 4/1/2010 at 04:14 PM
Eric Clapton plays slide alot in open A tunning and useing strats and acoustic open G tunning he dose use open tunning open E for rhythm like on some cuts of Tell The Truth some Derek and the Dominos track live had Dave Masson playing with them he was part of the Delany and Bonnie band at some point dont know the time line before or after Duane
they did some Dominos recording for a second album in England but they scraped it so Mason might have been on that and he was on out takes from 441 Oceans so he was on that sessions too



[Edited on 4/1/2010 by lyle]

[Edited on 4/5/2010 by lyle]

 

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  posted on 4/2/2010 at 05:54 PM
quote:
Eric Clapton plays slide alot in open A tunning and useing strats and acoustic open G tunning he dose use open tunning open E for rhythm like on some cuts of Tell The Truth some Derek and the Dominos track live had Dave Masson playing with them he was part of the Delany and Bonnie band at some point dont know the time line before or after Duane
they did some Dominos recording for a second album in England but they scraped it so Mason might have been on that and he was on out takes from 441 Oceans so he was on that sessions too
I know Abby from the Laya session he engineered that session
with the Alberts and Doud its been 20 years sence I talk with him Abby Galtlin i think thats how its spelled it he was my friend old band mate from NYC i think the band was Kimmberly as I recal l long time ago Oh ya another person ther at the sessions I talked with once was George Terry he was hang around ther and he told me things too but that was 20 years ago .. cant rremember much more he went on the work with Bee Gees and thats where I know him I did some work with friends of his /


[Edited on 4/1/2010 by lyle]


I believe it's Albhy Galutin.....I've seen that name on a lot of recordings that came out of Criteria in Miami.

[Edited on 4/2/2010 by brofan]

 

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  posted on 4/2/2010 at 05:57 PM
And George Terry was in Clapton's band from 461 OB until like Another Ticket....he was a damn good player and a very good slide player.

 

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  posted on 4/2/2010 at 11:49 PM
Thats alot to read..but what i do know is the show D and dominoes did in phildelphia...Where they played Ramblin on my miind.motherless chldren,and mean old world..the show i have is )ct. 16th 1970 right after the layla sessions give or take....that show Eric is dripping Duane licks off the neck of his'fiddle'
 

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  posted on 4/4/2010 at 05:14 PM
I was recently going through some of my Clapton shows and I came across the 2007-05-12 show where he guested with Winwood. They played a song called "Take It Easy" (not the Eagles song). The song is essentially One Way Out but i think in A instead of D. Not exactly related to the topic but kind of interesting to see EC playing that riff.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=25ICg-jf7jk

 

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  posted on 4/5/2010 at 12:02 PM
quote:
The song is essentially One Way Out but i think in A instead of D. Not exactly related to the topic but kind of interesting to see EC playing that riff


Unless I am mistaken, and I don't think I am, The Allmans version of One Way Out is in A, not D. Does anyone agree?

 
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