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Author: Subject: Philosophical Scalping Thoughts

A Peach Supreme





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  posted on 1/19/2009 at 09:15 AM
OK.......

Ticket Agencies legally scalp

Ticketmaster now legally scalps.
(Now I ponder this. As a band, if your ticket seller was able to sell tickets at 2X, 3X, 4X, etc of face, isn't it highly inconcievable the band would not get a cut of the now increased sale price? I have no idea, but until the band makes a statement to the contrary, I will presume.)

So my question is:

What is morally wrong with US scalping? If the bands management is involved, we don't condemn them, why is it such an unacceptable thing to buy or sell scalp price seats here?

What I am asking is, why are we the last bastions of brotherhood?

 

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Maximum Peach



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  posted on 1/19/2009 at 10:10 AM
quote:
What I am asking is, why are we the last bastions of brotherhood?

Just a guess, but most of us are old enough to remember a time way before scalping was a national business, when getting that prized ticket meant standing in line somewhere, or at most calling the box office. Most shows had regional draw - meaning the vast majority of attendees were local - giving you better feel for what you'd be dealing with in trying to obtain that ticket.

All that's gone now. It's better and worse at the same time. Buying tickets today sometimes feels like being on a commodity trading floor. I don't see it as unethical, just different from the past, like so many other things that have changed.






[Edited on 1/19/2009 by Fujirich]

 

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  posted on 1/19/2009 at 10:13 AM
I think there's just too much money to be made now scalping illegally, that it's crazy for the bands/promoters/venues etc to let someone else make it instead of them. It's happening in sports, theatre, everywhere.

 

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  posted on 1/19/2009 at 10:18 AM
quote:
If the bands management is involved, we don't condemn them, why is it such an unacceptable thing to buy or sell scalp price seats here?




In a round about way, scalping is approved by this website by having a direct link to the Ticketmaster site.

A small window of opportunity was provided for 60-80 thousand members here to try their luck on a limited number of seats during the pre-sale. I'm sure alot of talking and begging must have been done along with a ton of work and frustration in order to accomplish this. I would have thought the shows would actually sell out during the pre-sale with the numbers involved in the Peach Corps if 100 percent of the tickets were up for grabs during the pre-sale.

Ticketmaster....the Peach Whores.

quote:
Now I ponder this. As a band, if your ticket seller was able to sell tickets at 2X, 3X, 4X, etc of face, isn't it highly inconcievable the band would not get a cut of the now increased sale price? I have no idea, but until the band makes a statement to the contrary, I will presume.)


I'm waiting, but I don't think I'll hold my breath waiting on a reply from somebody other than the webmasters or HTN.



 

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  posted on 1/19/2009 at 10:28 AM
and... seeing that at random moments a few seats go up on Ticketmaster every so often cuts down on the scalping . I guess you just gotta keep hamerring away on the keyboard and be there at the right moment.

 

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True Peach



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  posted on 1/19/2009 at 10:42 AM
It looks like that auction thing is scalping, but it's not a whole lot different than the VIP deals offered by other bands. So, yes, I expect the band gets a cut of what the market price turns out to be for those tix.

However, Tickets Now is NOT scalping by TM, even though it owns the site. It is a marketplace of independent buyers and sellers, just like Ebay or Stubhub. All TM has done is provide a link to their site. If Tickets Now did not exist, scalpers could easily list on another marketplace site.

It is telling that Stubhub, not owned by TM, has better seats than Tickets Now (for 3-21 anyway, the only one I checked). If TM was skimming tix, they would choose the best ones for their own site.

As to why there is no scalping allowed on HTW, I'd like to think we should hold to a higher standard than the rest of the world.


 

Zen Peach



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  posted on 1/19/2009 at 10:54 AM
Face value... 99 dollars...buy it now 2000.00 dollars.
Scalping in my book.

 

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Extreme Peach



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  posted on 1/19/2009 at 11:04 AM
time for congressional hearing...also time for new anti-trust laws.

 

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True Peach



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  posted on 1/19/2009 at 11:09 AM
quote:
Face value... 99 dollars...buy it now 2000.00 dollars.
Scalping in my book.


It is scalping, but it's not TM doing it. They merely provide a way for someone else to do it. And if they didn't, someone else surely would, and does.


 

A Peach Supreme



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  posted on 1/19/2009 at 11:12 AM
quote:

However, Tickets Now is NOT scalping by TM, even though it owns the site. It is a marketplace of independent buyers and sellers, just like Ebay or Stubhub.



Are you sure?

 

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  posted on 1/19/2009 at 11:16 AM
To me the problem is the equal access to tickets. It seems that scalpers are always able to get seats to hot events, such as the Beacon run, whereas most of us here had pretty poor luck. If the average fan had the same chance at getting tickets as the scalpers, there would be less demand from fans(satisfied by general sales) and the scalpers would not be able to demand such high prices.

Whether they use software that is able to get them first crack or they have inside connections, they are turning these advantages into profit. Are these methods illegal or morally wrong? That's what gives them the ability to charge high prices, so that's the real question.

 

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  posted on 1/19/2009 at 11:18 AM
quote:
quote:

However, Tickets Now is NOT scalping by TM, even though it owns the site. It is a marketplace of independent buyers and sellers, just like Ebay or Stubhub.



Are you sure?


Look at the listings of tix for 3-21 they have there; pretty sub-average tix. Why would that be other than the tix coming from 3d parties? Tix Now has a sell tix feature, so yeah I'm pretty sure. Looks just like Stub Hub's model.

 

Zen Peach



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  posted on 1/19/2009 at 11:32 AM
quote:
time for congressional hearing...also time for new anti-trust laws.




the gov't don't enforce the ones they have.

 

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A Peach Supreme



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  posted on 1/19/2009 at 11:38 AM
Fans are not allowed to scalp because have not hired a lobbiest to bribe public off....er, represent our interests.
 

A Peach Supreme



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  posted on 1/19/2009 at 11:46 AM
As I said in another thread, as long as it is LEGAL to sell entry to an event at a greater price than the stated amount on the ticket, nothing will change. When it was illegal to do so, there were a few ads in the local paper and the usual suspects outside the venues and that was about it. Easy to police and if ya needed a ticket you could get one at a reasonable mark up.

A tried and true method that has always worked for me is to hang out in front of the venue until the show gets under way. Scalper prices plummet and I have never been shut out.

The Led Zeppelin experience of everyone waiting to get their tix the day before the show could not work on a continuous basis, however even with what we had to go through, there were still scalpers out front looking to buy or sell tix. The amount of people that went to the show under those circumstances was small.

There will always be comped tix for events and that will never change.

Anyone who believes the band members, their management or anyone else attached to the band doesn't know what is going on just don't get it.

My 2 cents

 

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  posted on 1/19/2009 at 11:47 AM
quote:
Face value... 99 dollars...buy it now 2000.00 dollars.
Scalping in my book.
I'm reading that same book. Don't like it, never have. I've never purchased tickets from a scalper, ticket broker, or a front for scalpers (like Tickets Now appears to be) and don't intend to. Not making any judgements about people who do ... I choose not to support these enterprises.

 

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Peach Master



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  posted on 1/19/2009 at 11:53 AM
How about getting some presale tix and then being able to up grading during the general sale....only something a real fan would do....now that real fan has a couple of extras....is it scalping to try to make an extra $25 or $30 dollars to cover, say, your parking or maybe a nice pre-show dinner....is that REALLY scalping????.....you'd probably end up selling them to another real fan anyway

[Edited on 1/19/2009 by MuleMe]

 

A Peach Supreme



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  posted on 1/19/2009 at 11:56 AM
quote:
How about getting some presale tix and then being able to up grading during the general sale....only something a real fan would do....now that real fan has a couple of extras....is it scalping to try to make an extra $25 or $30 dollars to cover, say, your parking or maybe a nice pre-show dinner....is that REALLY scalping????.....you'd probably end up selling them to another real fan anyway

[Edited on 1/19/2009 by MuleMe]




Why if you are upgrading and paying the same price do you need to profit? Sell them at fact value, if you don't you are scalping - period!

 

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Peach Master



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  posted on 1/19/2009 at 12:03 PM
Maybe because I used my credit (card) and went through the effort to get the tickets.....how about my time sitting at the computer and searching sometimes for hours to give YOU very good tickets.... at cost????......I'm not talking $100s mark up

[Edited on 1/19/2009 by MuleMe]

 

A Peach Supreme



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  posted on 1/19/2009 at 12:12 PM
You assume the person you are selling too did not do the same thing. They went through what you did and got nothing. How is their time compensated for? No one will argue any fees paid should not be added. In essence your cost should be covered, other than that you are scalping.

 

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Peach Master



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  posted on 1/19/2009 at 12:15 PM
Don't agree....
 

Zen Peach



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  posted on 1/19/2009 at 12:18 PM
quote:
Don't agree....


offer those fan club tickets for resale with a profit here and see how fast they get canceled.

 

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A Peach Supreme



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  posted on 1/19/2009 at 12:19 PM
Then we agree not to agree. You do what you need to do, but don't call it something its not. If ya take more than ya paid (face value plus any fees) you are scalping. If who you are selling too is okay with that, good for you for profiting on the transaction.

 

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  posted on 1/19/2009 at 12:32 PM
quote:
How about getting some presale tix and then being able to up grading during the general sale....only something a real fan would do....now that real fan has a couple of extras....is it scalping to try to make an extra $25 or $30 dollars to cover, say, your parking or maybe a nice pre-show dinner....is that REALLY scalping????.....you'd probably end up selling them to another real fan anyway

[Edited on 1/19/2009 by MuleMe]
Isn't selling tickets for a profit the very definition of scalping? And selling presale tickets for a profit is against the rules and nature of the presale. I doubt that the site sponsors a presale for which they must involve a lot of their own time both in organizing and double checking orders for fraud to have somebody making money off of it.

[Edited on 1/19/2009 by lolasdeb]

 

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  posted on 1/19/2009 at 01:02 PM
There has always been issues around the event every year, with folks getting blocked from tickets.

However, this year it seems no one got that weekend on general sale from this site....or did some folks?

 

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