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Author: Subject: Allman Brothers Band minus founding Brother Dickey Betts

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  posted on 4/1/2002 at 01:39 AM
I usually consider things after the fact, like the 30 year catalogue of live ABB recordings. Over the last year I started collecting live music on the internet. As such, I now have many live ABB shows and many more bands. In this context I still dig the ABB. But to my point, the ABB is not quite the same old ABB, for me, without Dickey. I hear all kinds of things about why he left the band, and there are those who are turned off, and still many more who dig the new lineup and the new picking. Anyway, I see it like this. First, Jaimoe and Butch are sidemen, as were some in Lynyrd Skynyrd. Sidemen are those guys who must tour to make a living. Dickey and Gregg wrote most of the ABB songs, and as such they receive song writing royalties. So do you have to wonder why Jaimoe or Butch are so morally pliable, if you choose to see it, or address it as a moral thing. Anyway, if the band wants to blame Dickey for them being stale, or for playing the same setlist, then let them. Sure, I wish they had played a diverse set from year to year, with lots of old **** . But you know,all my old Skynyrd shows are the same setlists too, and nobody in the new band can write decent music, and I am talking of Skynyrd. Anyway, I just see the ABB without Dickey as Gregg Allman and Friends. If you think Dickey is a lighthearted countryboy at heart, then you're probably right. And sure, Dickey could be dorky, and a little corny, but he was always human. Gregg on the other hand is a different person all together. Gregg wrote the soul and gritty stuff, and Dickey balanced the act with lighthearted material. Dickey did not write stuff like It's Not My Cross To Bear, Whipping Post, Every Hungry Woman, etc. Dickey wrote more lighthearted material like Bougainvillea, Ramblin' Man, Back Where it all Begins, Seven Turns, Blue Sky. And of course Dickey wrote all of his instrumentals, Liz Reed, High Falls, Pegasus, Nobody Knows, Kind of Bird, not sure about Kind of Bird or True Gravity. Anyway, Dickey was the other part of the greatness of this band. And if Dickey had a drinking part, well when was Gregg not on something himself through the whole history of the band? And the whole band used drugs recreationally, as a lifestyle. And this was balanced by periods of sobriety. Also there was the creative tension all the time in the band, of who would lead, of who would create. So if Dickey was a problem that Gregg could not deal with, then he isn't a problem now, and Gregg has a new band again, without his long time bandmate, and apparrent non-friend, Dickey Betts. And I am sure the guys would get sick of one another, the constant comparions and assessments as to who will lead, and or, carry the band. I for one see by song writing that Dickey carried the band on its last 3 studio albums. Does anybody think Gregg led in the song writing dept? Sure Gregg wrote or was a part of some great songs in the ninties, End of the Line, Sailing Across the Devil's Sea, All Night Train-- which is about his own drug abuse, and how about What's Done is Done where Gregg brags about womanizing? So why is Gregg now sainted while Dickey is tainted? Dickey Betts was a Great song writer and guitar player/ singer in the ABB. Gregg was all of these things too. But the band castrated itself when it let Dickey get away. And I guess they still play Dickey's songs arguing that they belong to the band. Well, I think it SUCKS, and before they play any show they should acknowledge using any songs that Dickey wrote singularly. And I am no great fan of Dickey solo or Gregg solo. I think they both found their magic playing together. Well, that is all I have to say tonight. And don't come saying **** to me about how I feel, OK?Peace. : ) [Edited on 4/1/2002 by JaminRebel]

 

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True Peach



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  posted on 4/1/2002 at 06:54 AM
Since you feel you have the right to state what you feel, then it is only fitting that you feel that we have the right to state our own feelings, yes?
Of course you do.
With that, I feel free to state that I think you're wrong on many counts, particularly the one where you claim that anyone disagreeing with you is spouting "****".
As for the rest of it, it's all been said before, the horse has died, if you won't bury it, at least let it lie.

 

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  posted on 4/1/2002 at 09:41 AM
Duane didn't "write" one single tune for this band (obviously w/ the exception of Little Martha), & yet, he still is the most important Brother out of them all. Did he not contribute to the band, even with his lack of contribution to songwriting?

In my opinion, who wrote what for this band is sometimes irrelevant. Not always.. but sometimes. The numbers games are nice & fun to keep count, but they really don't prove that much. Both Dickey & Gregg haven't "written" too many tunes since the early 70's. Well, atleast what has been recorded. They don't pump out songs in the Dylan/Neil Young perspective. There aren't too many ABB songs in their catalogue to begin with.

I don't quite understand why it's always Gregg vs. Dickey, & vice versa. Dickey's "drinking" problem. Or Butch, & his knife.... or was it the butler, in the library? Right or wrong. To me, it sounds like your typical case of people just not gettin' along.

 
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  posted on 4/1/2002 at 10:00 AM
Everybody is entitled to his/her opinion. After all, this is America. Rebel brought up some decent points but after all is said and done, it's all about the music, nothing more. It would have been nice to see Dickey stay in the band but they do not miss a beat with Warren and Derek. Just close your eyes and start sailin across the devil's sea.
 
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  posted on 4/1/2002 at 11:56 AM
Finsky's right, the songwriting or who wrote how many songs is not all that relevant when it comes to the ABB. This is a BAND, in which, when all is said and done, all the members create the music, not necessarily write it. That's how I've always thought ABB songs are structured, the song itself is an outline, with the band encouraged to fill in the blanks with their own playing. I've always thought that to especially be the case with Dickey's material.
Dickey's ouster took major guts for the band to do, and they should be admired for doing it. They knew it wouldn't be popular, but the music comes first, period. However, while I agree with the JaminRebel that Dickey should still be in the band, "lighthearted" will NEVER be a word that comes to my mind when it comes to Dickey's songs.
Onewayout is right, Warren and Derek are true Brothers who play ABB music just great -- jamming, uncliched, creating on the spot. That's where I really miss Dickey though, is in the spontaneous, on-stage composition. There was never another musician able to play what was in the air, better than Dickey, except maybe Duane, and the Dead on their good nights.

 

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  posted on 4/1/2002 at 01:59 PM
did any of us watch the Austin City Limits (1996) special on CMT the other night? Damn, Dickey tore it up. Of course Warren did too, but that's a given.

we can argue till the cows come home, but one thing is for sure- Dickey is missed.

 

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  posted on 4/1/2002 at 06:34 PM
Our stupid new cable company doesn't HAVE CMT.
??????????????????????
I don't get it.........

 

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  posted on 4/1/2002 at 06:45 PM
ABB vintage 96, seemed to be a very good year. I find myself digging out and digging on those shows more often than others.

 

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  posted on 4/1/2002 at 06:48 PM
Ahhh that's better, my eyes were burning from trying to read that whole spew up there. Mercy Me.

 

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  posted on 4/2/2002 at 12:36 AM
Butch & Jaimoe are NOT sidemen. The full-fledged members have always been Gregg, Duane, Dickey, Berry, Jaimoe & Butch, anyone else was always sidemen. Of course Duane & Berry are gone, so it became the four of them. Then Dickey was suspended. He was only "suspended". HE decided to leave after disagreeing with the reasons for the suspension and the ideas the band wanted to impliment. In a more recent interview, Dickey has mentioned it as a blessing in disguise due to him not agree with the direction the rest of the band was wanting. In the end, all the fans are going to have a difference of opinion and no one will be right. But one thing I have observed, is the four living members seem happier in the current situation than for longer than I can remember. We should accept that, embrace it and make the best of it. I for one (have been seeing & collection shows, several a year since 1992 or so) have been finding that there aren't many shows that can top the 2000-2002 era, so far. That's not to say that the 89-99 era was bad, but there are a LOT of little things I notice that make a BIG difference to me. The band is on fire, and people who don't agree should move on and let the fire spread to those of us who want to burn up in it! After all, it is all about the music. If I had no knowledge of the Brothers, their history or their music and someone played me a song from a 1971 show, a 1974 show, a 1995 show and a 2001 show, I think I'd love it all, no matter who's playing on it. I think that's the real test.
 

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  posted on 4/2/2002 at 12:58 AM
Way to go Pauli!

 

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  posted on 4/2/2002 at 07:07 AM
An important point, PauliG, it WAS Dickeys decision to make the split permanent, there are many that would like people to forget that.

 

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  posted on 4/2/2002 at 08:24 AM
Am glad that point has been brought out -- I'd always thought Dickey was informed by fax that he was being voted out of the band. I never knew that it was a suspension at first, or that Dickey ever agreed to it. In fact he was so upset that he was arrested after an alleged altercation with his wife, something that was caused by his dismissal. Never knew it was Dickey's decision to make the split permanent. Wow -- thanks for the info, and let me echo, WAY TO GO, PAULI G -- yours is the key post here.

 

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  posted on 6/29/2002 at 05:57 PM

 

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  posted on 6/29/2002 at 06:32 PM
Ah the good old days, that weren't always so good. You know, when I was writing about Dickey and all to defend him, I was pretty upset about how he was not in the abb, and how Gregg and the gang probably were now the happier for it.

Since I first made up some of these topics I now feel quite a bit different about the whole situation.

Dickey Betts has been doing just fine since he left the abb. I realize that the DBB and DB&GS are not the abb, but then they don't have to be. I now have many live shows by both of these latest musical incarnations, and I must say that both lineups have a lot to offer. I don't know all the songs yet on the two newest Dickey cds nor all of the songs played on the live shows. Actually, I must know about 99% of them, but I do still find some unfamiliar songs.
Anyway, to make a long story short, both of Dickey's bands have had a lot to offer, and DB&GS is probably a little more appealing. I have a version of Back Where it all Begins from the Freebird Cafe in Jacksonville, FL, 5/18/02, a show taped by PaulR, aka "the man" and the song is just sublime, as is tthat version of High Falls,. Southboundwith Matt Zeiner on vocals is an ass kicker, and Matt is a decent singer. Immortal is a great song that Matt wrote. Dona Marie is great, Beyond the Pale is great as well. In short, I am collecting these shows, and I would have to say the 2002 shows are a little better than some of the others. I am usually the very last person to recommend something realatively new, but I think Dickey and Great Southern are really peaking. They are hitting the note.

So, I no longer lament Dickey not being in the abb. Dickey is proving his detrators wrong. Dickey is again making great music. Dickey is in the spotlight in his band, and I am in to it. Check it out. Fans of the abb now have two really good bands to follow. If you need a Dickey "fix" it can readilly be found on the new Great Southern recordings, and also on the Dickey Betts Band recordings. Don't be mistaken, Dickey is making history again, but in a new way, and not with the abb. Peace.

 

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  posted on 6/30/2002 at 01:19 PM
Good call bro, you said it well. **** happens for a reason, yet it all has worked out for the good as it always does in the ABB family tree, and once agin reminds anew that it all -- ALL of it -- comes back to the simple unalienable fact that the river keeps flowing the grass still grows/the spirit keeps going/NOBODY KNOWS.
Hm, wonder wehy I can't make a smiley face[Edited on 6/30/2002 by Stephen]

 

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  posted on 7/1/2002 at 01:12 PM
Stephen - I know the post was from April, but I just read it, where you say that Dickey could play what was in the air better than anyone ever, except mabye Duane and the Dead on a good night. I guess that's what I miss most.

 

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  posted on 7/10/2002 at 12:37 AM
nobody is going to get along all the time,but i gotta agree that with DB&GS, that's just more good music to listen to.
 
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  posted on 8/21/2002 at 03:29 PM
I agree with diamondjim
 

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  posted on 8/21/2002 at 03:41 PM
The only ones who can settle things are the ones involved,it could happen but it might not.So enjoy the music they put out.Peace
 
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  posted on 8/27/2002 at 01:56 PM
I was afraid without Dickey the authenticity of the Band would be compromised. I wish Dickey was around on the other hand I accept the change and welcome a new beggining (Hopefully) for the band. After seeing them in concert sunday, I reminded myself of my last show in "91. That show was so damn loud it may have been the reason I passed on The Brothers w/the Feat the very next year. Their sound is now at a manageable level. I was able to enjoy the brothers as if I was listening to my sterio loud.

There still should be a place for Dickey in the leagacy of this band. He was great!! and I hope maybe someday they will work it out. But for now the road is all Warren's and Derick's..[Edited on 8/27/2002 by MarkSmith]

 

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  posted on 8/27/2002 at 02:35 PM
Mark, you hit it on the head.
 
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  posted on 9/10/2002 at 04:10 AM
WWW.GRITZ.NETextensive interview with Dickey...he leaves a crack open....read it see what ya think. I think that wounds are deep and it might take a slight miricale BUT never say never!!!!!!! Maybe the "Brothers will ride again!" To see Gregg , Warren, , Dickey , Mark, Otiel, Jaimoe, and Butchy play again..Man I'd pay big to see it! But it is and has been Dickey's way or no way for a long time and I don't know if this band is ready for it..I sure am!!!!!!!!!! Michaek //RedTailWolf
Michael "RedTail Wolf" Nystrom.....GRITZ Magazine

 
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  posted on 9/10/2002 at 05:23 AM
Not if it means the show closes with No One Left to Run With every night for three years I'm not.

 

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  posted on 9/10/2002 at 06:34 AM

We appreciate your sharing your thoughts, Redtail, but this forum is not the appropriate place for you to promote your commercial Web site and magazine. I'm sure Lana and Rowland would be happy to accept your advertising dollars.


[Edited on 9/10/2002 by Hophead]

 

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