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Author: Subject: Your opinion on 2006 IL mix and fidelity

Peach Master





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  posted on 1/24/2007 at 02:21 PM
Wanted to get the hardcore listener's point of view on the mix and sound quality of this year's batch of IL's - not the performance, setlist choices, etc - compared to previous years...and some taper's versions, in some cases.

Cheers.

 

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Extreme Peach



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  posted on 1/24/2007 at 03:47 PM
I've bought the Jones Beach IL the last 3 years since I've attended those shows the last 3 years and the sound quality on this years is way below that of the previous 2 years. I'm waiting on my other 2 IL's ( Which I'm guessing I"ll recieve in the next few days ) to see if it's just that show or if it's the recording they did this past season.

 

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Peach Master



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  posted on 1/24/2007 at 04:24 PM
We know the Scranton show's sound is the among the worst of the last three years.

My 4/15 starts off rough, soundoing like the levels were way too high to start, distortion is gone by disc two.


One thing that gets me is that these shows started out at $20 the first year.

It went over so well they were $25 the following year.

I attended the Saturday Falls View Casino show in Niagara Falls.

Show wasn't even two hours, yet they felt the need to still put it on three discs.

I understand shorter times per disc for the three disc, longer shows, about not having to burn a large capacity final disc while everyone waits for the finished IL's.

But when it's a 100 minute show (or less), why cant you burn disc one at 75 minutes and disc two at 25?

I made a two disc copy for the car and it EASILY fit with plenty of empty space on disc two.

 

Peach Master



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  posted on 1/24/2007 at 04:25 PM
When you buy these shows after the fact, months later, are they still three discs regardless of run time?
 

True Peach



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  posted on 1/24/2007 at 04:47 PM
My Cleveland IL sounds fantastic for an IL.... the Canada and bufallo shows aren't bad either... though not as good as Cleveland

 

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Extreme Peach



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  posted on 1/24/2007 at 05:08 PM
I've only listened to it a bit, but my ATL '06 is not as good as my '05 ILs.

 

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Peach Master



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  posted on 1/24/2007 at 06:29 PM
ok here goes....
Over the last 3 years I've bought 4 IL's ( Rockford, Il. '04, and Rosemont, Il. 04-06 )
I will continue to buy them if not for historical purposes anyway. As many of you know
I also recorded these same 4 shows.
A big THANK YOU to the ABB and its Management for allowing both to co-exist !
A couple of things need to be kept in mind, the speed in which you get the show, to get all the copies out that evening they have to start burning disc 1's before the show as ended. With the different set lists there could only be guestimates as to when to make a cut off point and start another disc. This is generally around the 45-55 min mark. You have to get that disc completed and finalized before you can start the process of disc 2 . I know with the technology for high speed transfer has made the process a very quick one , but you still need to follow the formula. Now the next part used to be very tricky and was the cause of many a rumble around here about a long song ( i.e. Mtn Jam , IMoER etc. ) getting chopped into 2 discs. Well the band realized that this was in their control, by changing the set list slightly we now get the whole big jam on disc 2. Remember the band does have a vested interest in this project. So now we come to the cost, with the cost at 25.00 a pop you have to have a product that "seems" worth it.
25.00 for 2 discs is very steep and would probable be too high a price point to maximize sales, so now 3 it may seem high but it's in the "range" where the target market is appealed. And with 3 discs you get this very thick package to hold the discs in , not a flimsy 2 disc thin piece of plastic and with the large volume the cost is insignificant.
As for the sound , I think the IL's have gotten better each year, 04 was the worst because I don't think the soundboard was mixed into the shows well or at all. The 05-06 had much more separation in speakers of the musicians and were able to pick up things an Audience recording couldn't.I think the '05 is better than the '06. As with most soundboards they sound really good, but a little flat - everything is there. My audience recordings are as close to if not better, I don't want to toot my own horn so I'll leave it to others to say. Now you cant always get the great recordings without a little luck, seats in the right area for the sound, cool people around you who realize that a taper is having fun also, why some go out of their way to be jerks around a mic stand is something I don't understand and usually alcohol is the fuel for these folks ( nothing against tipping a few, I've been known to have a snort now and then ) the venue security folks are also an obstacle sometimes, so a lot more luck is needed for a good audience recording that the I.L.s donít have to worry about thus more likely to get a good show then "taper" in the crowd.
well I've raved on long enough, think I'll put on the 05 Rosemont I.L with Ron & Jack
sittin' in for Warren , love the Dimples from that night.


[Edited on 1/24/2007 by marco]

 

Peach Master



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  posted on 1/24/2007 at 07:09 PM
quote:
ok here goes....
Over the last 3 years I've bought 4 IL's ( Rockford, Il. '04, and Rosemont, Il. 04-06 )
I will continue to buy them if not for historical purposes anyway. As many of you know
I also recorded these same 4 shows.
A big THANK YOU to the ABB and its Management for allowing both to co-exist !
A couple of things need to be kept in mind, the speed in which you get the show, to get all the copies out that evening they have to start burning disc 1's before the show as ended. With the different set lists there could only be guestimates as to when to make a cut off point and start another disc. This is generally around the 45-55 min mark. You have to get that disc completed and finalized before you can start the process of disc 2 . I know with the technology for high speed transfer has made the process a very quick one , but you still need to follow the formula. Now the next part used to be very tricky and was the cause of many a rumble around here about a long song ( i.e. Mtn Jam , IMoER etc. ) getting chopped into 2 discs. Well the band realized that this was in their control, by changing the set list slightly we now get the whole big jam on disc 2. Remember the band does have a vested interest in this project. So now we come to the cost, with the cost at 25.00 a pop you have to have a product that "seems" worth it.
25.00 for 2 discs is very steep and would probable be too high a price point to maximize sales, so now 3 it may seem high but it's in the "range" where the target market is appealed. And with 3 discs you get this very thick package to hold the discs in , not a flimsy 2 disc thin piece of plastic and with the large volume the cost is insignificant.
As for the sound , I think the IL's have gotten better each year, 04 was the worst because I don't think the soundboard was mixed into the shows well or at all. The 05-06 had much more separation in speakers of the musicians and were able to pick up things an Audience recording couldn't.I think the '05 is better than the '06. As with most soundboards they sound really good, but a little flat - everything is there. My audience recordings are as close to if not better, I don't want to toot my own horn so I'll leave it to others to say. Now you cant always get the great recordings without a little luck, seats in the right area for the sound, cool people around you who realize that a taper is having fun also, why some go out of their way to be jerks around a mic stand is something I don't understand and usually alcohol is the fuel for these folks ( nothing against tipping a few, I've been known to have a snort now and then ) the venue security folks are also an obstacle sometimes, so a lot more luck is needed for a good audience recording that the I.L.s donít have to worry about thus more likely to get a good show then "taper" in the crowd.
well I've raved on long enough, think I'll put on the 05 Rosemont I.L with Ron & Jack
sittin' in for Warren , love the Dimples from that night.


[Edited on 1/24/2007 by marco]

Thanks. I thought that I was going nuts. Comparing the last 4 years, listening at home, car, and headphones I thought the 06 recording understated the rhythm section and featured only the guitars - with clear channel separation. My neighbor who is quite the audiophile (mostly staright ahead bop) favors the 03 recording as some of the best recorded live music in his vast collection (the performances are right up there as well).
Candidly, I was dissapointed in this year's crop of recordings. The richness, depth and orcherstral feel for the total sound are lost, imo. To your point, some of the audience recordings, especially from indoor venues, are fuller and a more accurate representation of the sound at a show.
Then again, it could be just a state of mind thing.......................

 

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Maximum Peach



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  posted on 1/24/2007 at 07:16 PM
From memory...

Cincinnati good
Cleveland good
Bristow good
Erie good

,but one of the Niagra ones sounded like an audience recording, not a soundboard. Not because of crowd noise, but the way the band sounded (muffled).

[Edited on 1/25/2007 by nebish]

 

Peach Master



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  posted on 1/24/2007 at 07:17 PM
The Niagara show faded out the start of Jessica on D2 and faded it in on D3.

Annoying since there was so much blank space on those discs.

Also, for the size of the crowd, (casino showroom) it took longer to get those out than some of the outdoor shows I've been to.

Thanks for the info Marco, I have several shows you did that sound much better than the IL's.

 

Maximum Peach



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  posted on 1/24/2007 at 07:22 PM
The taper copy of the Red Rocks show was much better than the IL version. We listened to 3 different versions of the shows and the copy from the taper who taped it from the 4th row had a much cleaner copy and the mix was more natural rather than the monkeyed with version.......

There thats my 2 cents worth.........

 

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Peach Master



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  posted on 1/24/2007 at 07:42 PM
I'd give Matt a nickel for that review.
 

Zen Peach



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  posted on 1/24/2007 at 10:08 PM
quote:
The Niagara show faded out the start of Jessica on D2 and faded it in on D3.

Annoying since there was so much blank space on those discs.

Also, for the size of the crowd, (casino showroom) it took longer to get those out than some of the outdoor shows I've been to.

Thanks for the info Marco, I have several shows you did that sound much better than the IL's.


Thats cuz we americans couldn't handle the currency exchange... give them 25 american, and get 5 dollars in funny money back. hah

 

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True Peach



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  posted on 1/24/2007 at 10:23 PM
There were a number of 2 disc $20 shows, including Camden, Hartford, Saratoga and Darien Springs- all the show where the Allmans opened for Tom Petty.

 

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Peach Master



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  posted on 1/24/2007 at 10:28 PM
quote:
There were a number of 2 disc $20 shows, including Camden, Hartford, Saratoga and Darien Springs- all the show where the Allmans opened for Tom Petty.


I chose not to attend any of those "openers".

At least they got a bargain on the IL.

Too bad Niagara wasn't included.

 

Peach Pro



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  posted on 1/25/2007 at 12:33 AM
I attended the Raleigh show and purchased the IL. The IL is very good. Only minor flaw is the breakup of the drum solo in IMOER between disc 2 and disc 3. Still an accurate accounting of a great night of music. Well worth $25 IMO.

Tom

 

Peach Head



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  posted on 1/26/2007 at 12:23 AM
In order of best to worst so far by years. 2005 all sounded amazing! Holy Sh@t we got lucky! Everything is loud and well balanced.
Then 2003, all six of em sounded pretty close, mix wise, to the 05's but overall down a step or a half of a step in quality.
Then the 2004's....down at least a step or two from the overall balance of the 05's and 03's. The bass guitar seems to be either too loud or not loud enough. The overall volume of all the instruments seems to be bit lower, but I still enjoyed the f*ck out of em. Especially the 3 Atlanta shows.
And the 06's. Now I only have Scranton, SPAC, and Darien Lake. Pretty disapointed with all them especially the Scranton. For Scranton, Warren seems to be louder than Derek and the drums are poo poo ca ca. The Darien Lake and SPAC are ok but the any of my 05's or 03's seem to be a lot better and better balanced.
I have all 6 of the 03's, maybe 12 to 14 of the 04's, 16 of the 05's and the 3 from 06.
Now I would still buy a few more of the 06's IF I had the dough, but not as many at once like I have in the past because of the sound quality.
I bought the 06's at the shows. I don't know if that makes a difference or not but I heard a rumour that some shows get remixed after the original pressing at the shows????
I would guess because it's INSTANT live there would be no remixing? Anyone? But I would guess it's gotta be bitch mixing and recording the Allmans or the Black Crowes shows because of different sized rooms or if someones amp is louder than the other guitarist's amp then the guys at the board would have to adjust the levels?...er somthing.
Anyone care to school me in the ways of live recording and or mixing sound boarding stuff.

 

Peach Head



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  posted on 1/26/2007 at 09:39 AM
i purchased the hartford show, yeah $20 and it sounded pretty good, not great. i found some of the levels to be off and/or exaggerated to how you really hear them. the drums/percussuion was way too upfront, to the point of being obnoxious. don't get me wrong, they have one of the best percussion line-ups, but it was too much. lastly, i have to concur with a previous poster who said that warren was much more pronounced in the mix compared to derek. all in all, i'll still keep buying them.

[Edited on 1/26/2007 by choobachew]

 

Peach Head



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  posted on 1/27/2007 at 02:01 AM
One more thing I wanted to add. The over all balance and mix seems to vary from show to show on the 2006's but all the other years seem to be very consistent from the begining of the tour to the end of the tour. PLEASE correct me if I'm wrong. I'd LOVE to hear that any of 2006's sound as good if not better than the 2005's.
 

True Peach



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  posted on 1/27/2007 at 07:03 AM
quote:
quote:
There were a number of 2 disc $20 shows, including Camden, Hartford, Saratoga and Darien Springs- all the show where the Allmans opened for Tom Petty.


I chose not to attend any of those "openers".

At least they got a bargain on the IL.

Too bad Niagara wasn't included.


I saw the Saratoga and Camden ABB/Petty shows. Camden, in particular was a great show. Not as long an Allman set as when they headline, but A DTB opener, amazing Allman's set with Highway 61 w/ Petty and the summer's only Layla. We stayed for part of Petty, enough to see Gregg guest on Little Red Rooster. I'm glad I went

 

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Peach Head



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  posted on 2/7/2007 at 08:15 PM
The Mars Volta kill maximum amounts of ass.
 
 


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