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Author: Subject: Food for Thought, Concerning The War in Iraq

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  posted on 5/17/2004 at 01:38 PM
This is a letter from Ray Reynolds, a medic in the Iowa Army National Guard, serving in Iraq:

As I head off to Baghdad for the final weeks of my stay in Iraq, I wanted to say thanks to all of you who did not believe the media. They have done a very poor job of covering everything that has happened. I am sorry that I have not been able to visit all of you during my two week leave back home. And just so you can rest at night knowing something is happening in Iraq that is noteworthy, I thought I would pass this on to you. This is the list of things that has happened in Iraq recently: (Please share it with your friends and compare it to the version that your paper is producing.)

* Over 400,000 kids have up-to-date immunizations.
* School attendance is up 80% from levels before the war.
* Over 1,500 schools have been renovated and rid of the weapons stored there so education can occur.
* The port of Uhm Qasar was renovated so grain can be off-loaded from ships faster.
* The country had its first 2 billion barrel export of oil in August.
* Over 4.5 million people have clean drinking water for the first time ever in Iraq.
* The country now receives 2 times the electrical power it did before the war.
* 100% of the hospitals are open and fully staffed, compared to 35% before the war.
* Elections are taking place in every major city, and city councils are in place.
* Sewer and water lines are installed in every major city.
* Over 60,000 police are patrolling the streets.
* Over 100,000 Iraqi civil defense police are securing the country.
* Over 80,000 Iraqi soldiers are patrolling the streets side by side with US soldiers.
* Over 400,000 people have telephones for the first time ever.
* Students are taught field sanitation and hand washing techniques to prevent the spread of germs.
* An interim constitution has been signed.
* Girls are allowed to attend school.
* Textbooks that don't mention Saddam are in the schools for the first time in 30 years.

Don't believe for one second that these people do not want us there. I have met many, many people from Iraq that want us there, and in a bad way. They say they will never see the freedoms we talk about but they hope their children will. We are doing a good job in Iraq and I challenge anyone, anywhere to dispute me on these facts. So If you happen to run into John Kerry, be sure to give him my email address and send him to Denison, Iowa. This soldier will set him straight. If you are like me and very disgusted with how this period of rebuilding has been portrayed, email this to a friend and let them know there are good things happening.

Ray Reynolds, SFC
Iowa Army National Guard
234th Signal Battalion

 
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Zen Peach



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  posted on 5/17/2004 at 02:31 PM
http://www.whotv.com/Global/story.asp?S=1867073

 

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  posted on 5/17/2004 at 02:39 PM
Most of the info in there isn't true, though...
http://www.orwelliantimes.com/2004/04/26.html

 

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  posted on 5/17/2004 at 03:12 PM
The Orwellian Times, you got to love it. Now for some real life news;

Sarin nerve agent bomb? Wow, how did that get there? I'm stunned!!!! Oops!! It will be interesting to see how sources like the Orwellian Times explain that one.

Meanwhile;

http://www.wlbz2.com/newscenter/article.asp?id=13686

quote:
INJURED RESERVIST RETURNS HOME

Sergeant David Miller, 33, an Army reservist from Rockland, says he thinks all but two or three percent of Iraqis support the U.S. occupation of their country.

(Rockland-AP) -- Miller was shot in the right arm on Easter Sunday and this weekend came home for a month of R & R before he returns to Washington for physical therapy.
Miller got to Iraq in early February. He was driving 18-wheel tanker trucks full of fuel to U.S. bases. He was injured when a convoy he was driving in was attacked outside of Baghdad.

Miller says most locals, including the thousands who worked on the base where he was stationed, were happy to have the U.S. military there. And Miller says there's a good reason for that. He says American soldiers are doing a lot of good work there, like getting water and electricity running again, that's not making the news over here.




quote:
Iraqi General Urges Support of U.S. Troops


By KATARINA KRATOVAC


FALLUJAH, Iraq (AP) - A former Saddam Hussein-era general appointed by the Americans to lead an Iraqi security force in the rebellious Sunni stronghold of Fallujah urged tribal elders and sheiks Sunday to support U.S. efforts to stabilize Iraq.

Retired Maj. Gen. Mohammed Abdul-Latif rose to prominence after nearly monthlong battles last month between the Marines monthlong battles in April between the Marines and insurgents hunkered down in Fallujah's neighborhoods.

"We can make them (Americans) use their rifles against us or we can make them build our country, it's your choice," Latif told a gathering of more than 40 sheiks, city council members and imams in an eastern Fallujah suburb.

The siege of this city of 200,000 people, located about 40 miles west of Baghdad, was lifted when top Marine officers announced the creation of the Fallujah Brigade - a force made exclusively of former Iraqi army officers.

The Marines withdrew from Fallujah into the rural hinterland and far-flung suburbs, allowing the Iraqi force to take up positions and start patrols inside the city. The brigade is expected to number about 1,500 men, many of them conscripts or noncommissioned officers under Saddam.

They are expected to fight the guerrillas, although some of the same insurgents who fought the Marines last month will likely join the brigade.

On Sunday, Marines of the 1st Battalion, 5th Regiment provided security for the gathering in Kharma.

Latif, 66, a native of Baghdad, urged the elders to talk freely, citing the Muslim holy book, the Quran.

"The Quran says we should sit together, discuss and make a decision, but let it be the right decision," the silver-haired Latif - a slim figure wearing a blue shirt and dark blue tie and pants - told the sheiks.

The venue offered a rare insight into Latif's interactions and influence over Fallujah elders. As he spoke, many sheiks nodded in approval and listened with reverence to his words. Later, they clasped his hands and patted Latif on the back.

Latif, speaking in Arabic to the sheiks, defended the Marines and the U.S. occupation of Iraq.

"They were brought here by the acts of one coward who was hunted out of a rathole - (and backed by protesters determined to leave him in power-says Derek) Saddam - who disgraced us all," Latif said. "Let us tell our children that these men (U.S. troops) came here to protect us.

"As President Bush said, they did not come here to occupy our land but to get rid of Saddam. We can help them leave by helping them do their job, or we can make them stay ten years and more by keeping fighting."

Lt. Col. Brennan Byrne, the Marine battalion commander, said, "No truer words have been spoken here today than those by General Latif."

Latif also told the insurgents to "stop doing stupid things."

"Those bullets that are fired will not get the Americans out, let them finish their job here so that they can return to their country," Latif said.

"Our country is precious, stop allowing the bad guys to come from outside Iraq to destroy our country."

Latif, a former military intelligence officer said to have been imprisoned by Saddam and exiled, praised the former Iraqi army.

"The army used to be honest until Saddam made the men turn into beasts, take bribes, betray their own country," he said. "The real army is the army that works hard to serve its own citizens, with courage and strength."

After the meeting, Latif told The Associated Press that the situation in Fallujah has greatly improved, that "winds of peace" prevail in the city and the people that fled the fighting have returned. He would not elaborate on the size or current activities of the Fallujah Brigade.

"Let us speak about peace," Latif said in English. "Fallujah was an open wound, now it's healing."

http://apnews.myway.com/article/20040516/D82JRHQ80.html



[Edited on 5/17/2004 by DerekFromCincinnati]

 

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  posted on 5/17/2004 at 03:22 PM
Both, Do seem to be propaganda talking points, however, any good being done in Iraq will be critizied by the anti-war movement. What's good news for most Americans with respect to Iraq is bad news for the others. The doom and gloom effect.
 

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  posted on 5/17/2004 at 04:24 PM
quote:
What's good news for most Americans with respect to Iraq is bad news for the others.


Why do you and others feel that way? Honest question, Clay. Seems to me good news is good news. It seems to me comments like that only serve to split everyone further apart.

 

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  posted on 5/17/2004 at 06:40 PM
quote:
quote:
What's good news for most Americans with respect to Iraq is bad news for the others.


Why do you and others feel that way? Honest question, Clay. Seems to me good news is good news. It seems to me comments like that only serve to split everyone further apart.



http://www.cbn.com/CBNNews/News/030306a.asp
http://www.nationalreview.com/comment/comment-hollander032403.asp

[Edited on 5/18/2004 by ClayPelland]

 

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  posted on 5/17/2004 at 06:57 PM
--------------------------------------------------------------------------- ------------------------------------------------
What's good news for most Americans with respect to Iraq is bad news for the others.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------- -----------------------------------------------

It is always good news when an anointed president lies to the people he allegedly represents......no doubt there are lots of iraqis who want us there....no doubt there are lots that don't.......same as americans.....soldiers and not Clay........
when you start with a lie you end up with sh*t........we're doing such a great a job that all of the middle east and the rest of the world have lined up to thank us.....
our allies think we're the greatest......our enemies too....ya think so??
there is no goods news- just more republican bush cheney scumbag friends & democratic insiders getting rich over the blood of soldiers.......gee what a great day in a great country......not to mention a splendid example of our worldly goodness......please.......
john kerry is a far better human being than any of the sh*t presently in washington.....
most may not recognize it......too bad........can't wait fo the whole world to be safe for americans.......only the army can do that......yeah sure...........



 

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  posted on 5/17/2004 at 07:06 PM
quote:
--------------------------------------------------------------------- ------------------------------------------------------
What's good news for most Americans with respect to Iraq is bad news for the others.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------- -----------------------------------------------

It is always good news when an anointed president lies to the people he allegedly represents......no doubt there are lots of iraqis who want us there....no doubt there are lots that don't.......same as americans.....soldiers and not Clay........
when you start with a lie you end up with sh*t........we're doing such a great a job that all of the middle east and the rest of the world have lined up to thank us.....
our allies think we're the greatest......our enemies too....ya think so??
there is no goods news- just more republican bush cheney scumbag friends & democratic insiders getting rich over the blood of soldiers.......gee what a great day in a great country......not to mention a splendid example of our worldly goodness......please.......
john kerry is a far better human being than any of the sh*t presently in washington.....
most may not recognize it......too bad........can't wait fo the whole world to be safe for americans.......only the army can do that......yeah sure...........




Chad, Point made with the above.LMMFAO!!

 

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  posted on 5/17/2004 at 08:35 PM
quote:
john kerry is a far better human being than any of the sh*t presently in washington.....


If that is so, how do you reconcile that with John Kerry's own statement that he comitted war atrocities and violated the Geneva Conventions himself in Vietnam? That kind of gives "a far better human being" a new meaning to me. Of course I think he was lying then, but he still said it.

 

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  posted on 5/17/2004 at 09:30 PM
Peachnutt, in mulling over the fact that you are living in the wrong country, I am curious..what other country is there in the world that does it right and does it better than the ole USA???

 

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  posted on 5/19/2004 at 09:50 PM
derek-
i love my country.......i love my family & friends too.....but it is an obligation that we all of share- to tell your friends when the behave like asses, to open your mouths to your family when they've done wrong.....and the same, even more so, of our gov't.
this is in many ways the greatest nation on earth because everydays folks can still pretty much freely speak their minds (almost).......my point is (IMHO) that we would be much better off listening to others on this planet that we share instead of attempting to dictate to them............nothing happens in a vacuum.......we should learn what brings these situations
into existence...instead of trying to take facts that fit our preconceived or emotional notions....
but we are all to often a rather pompous and bloated bunch.....we make an awful lot of noise for less than 10% of the worlds population......i think we would be better served if we remember that number......and perhaps a more appropriate place for ourselves...

 

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  posted on 5/19/2004 at 09:58 PM
quote:
--------------------------------------------------------------------------- ---------------------------------------------
john kerry is a far better human being than any of the sh*t presently in washington.....
--------------------------------------------------------------------------- ----------------------------------------------

how do we reconcile bush being awol for national guard duty?
how do we reconcile where and how he made his millions? how do we reconcile the cronyism of the reagan-bush era folks all becoming mega mega millionaires through their gov't connections.......
how do you reconcile haliburton and cheney, betchel and casper weinberger....
america means follow the money - it's the only thing we as a nation are truly concerned about.......don't go by public pronouncments....watch what we do instead....
reconcile that....




[Edited on 5/20/2004 by PeachNutt]

 

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  posted on 5/19/2004 at 10:02 PM
BTW - find me a human that hasn't lied to better promote himself.....
I'll bet there aren't any, and never have been any.........

 

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  posted on 5/19/2004 at 10:08 PM
quote:
we make an awful lot of noise for less than 10% of the worlds population.

I also know that folks from all over the world are doing what they can to get I-N-T-O this country, and the other western democracies, not the other way around. I don't see boat people risking their lives to get to Cuba, or Iran, pre-war Iraq or other non-democratic countries. Democracies tend to not attack and go to war with other democracies. The arab nation is the least democratic part of the world, and the source of a lot of the problems. It's like, "hey Cuba, it's cool that you folks are forced to stay on your island while I am free to go as I please." "Hey North Korea, it is cool that you guys live under dictatorship, deal with forced labor, and are forced to stay within the borders of your country by your dictator while I think about my vacation plans here in America." "Hey, women of the arab world, and women of the taliban, I apologize for removing the taliban from power and at least giving you more freedom than before. Music is illegal, as is not wearing a beard? So what, that doesn't affect me here in the States. I will do as you wish and ignore it completely because America is bad, bad, bad and uses too much oil."

Whatever. Meanwhile, what other country is there in the world that does it right and does it better than the ole USA???

DH

 

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  posted on 5/20/2004 at 04:48 PM
quote:
quote:
--------------------------------------------------------------------------- ---------------------------------------------
john kerry is a far better human being than any of the sh*t presently in washington.....
--------------------------------------------------------------------------- ----------------------------------------------
If that is so, how do you reconcile that with John Kerry's own statement that he comitted war atrocities and violated the Geneva Conventions himself in Vietnam? That kind of gives "a far better human being" a new meaning to me. Of course I think he was lying then, but he still said it.

quote:

how do we reconcile bush being awol for national guard duty?
how do we reconcile where and how he made his millions? how do we reconcile the cronyism of the reagan-bush era folks all becoming mega mega millionaires through their gov't connections.......
how do you reconcile haliburton and cheney, betchel and casper weinberger....
america means follow the money - it's the only thing we as a nation are truly concerned about.......don't go by public pronouncments....watch what we do instead....
reconcile that....



The statement I made wasn't about Bush. I'm not pro-Bush. It was about John Kerry and him being a "far better human being".


quote:
BTW - find me a human that hasn't lied to better promote himself.....
I'll bet there aren't any, and never have been any.........


Not saying they all don't lie either, they do. The problem for me with John Kerry's lies are that his brought shame, dishonor, and disgrace on a whole lot of my countrymen, some of whom were my friends, who served this nation out of a sense of duty and obligation and did so with courage and honor and in some cases thier lives. His bull **** with Hubbard and Fonda and the ensuing fraud known as Winter Soldier, were to furthur his agenda at the price of other men's honor (both living & dead) and at a cost of tainting this nations views of our Vietnam Vets and causing many to be treated with a disrepect that they did not deserve.

I can understand that many lie to cover their own asses, but John Kerry's lies were about other men, at their expense and at a price that he will never be able to pay.

 

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  posted on 5/21/2004 at 03:23 PM
quote:
Most of the info in there isn't true, though...



Marley, let me sprinkle some common sense on your head, and we'll see if it sinks in.......

You have your source ( a pretty sh*tty one if you ask me), and he has his source (a soldier in Iraq).

Why is it that your source is right, and his isn't? It's a simple question that you should be able to answer. Why is it that your source is ALWAYS right, and anyone else's is ALWAYS wrong?

Do you have any idea how much of a pompous a$$ you make yourself out to be? You think your opinion is the almighty truth to the world. Get a clue man.

 

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  posted on 5/21/2004 at 03:44 PM
quote:
Both, Do seem to be propaganda talking points, however, any good being done in Iraq will be critizied by the anti-war movement. What's good news for most Americans with respect to Iraq is bad news for the others. The doom and gloom effect.
quote:
Why do you and others feel that way? Honest question, Clay. Seems to me good news is good news. It seems to me comments like that only serve to split everyone further apart.
I won't attempt to speak for Clay, but since I happen to be one of the "others" who feel the same way, I'm going to at least partially answer this.

First, when I think in these terms, I'm thinking of Democratic politicians and party operatives moreso than rank and file general population people. "Party operatives" may well be members of the media as well.

Take the economy. Not a single economic indicator says that this present economy is "the worst in xxx years." Yet we hear that constantly. Why? Because if the economy is good, it's good for Bush, if it's bad, it's good for Kerry. What's bad for the economy is good for Kerry. It's indisputable.

Take Iraq. What is it now, 3 weeks of Abu Ghraib coverage? Nick Berg is but a footnote in history. Why? Because his murder highlights so well why we're fighting there. Can't have the masses understanding that. Same with the mutilations in Fallujah. Two infinitely more noteworthy stories than some people being humiliated by women and forced to wear panties on their head. But we can't have the reasons for being there hilighted. We've got to be spoonfed a daily dribble of more pictures, now videos and endless editorializing and speculation about how high this scandal goes. Rumsfeld and Bush are almost always mentioned in the prison story. Zarkawi and bin Laden almost never mentioned if those other two stories get any coverage at all, except of course, for the times I've seen them discount the possibility that Zarkawi had anything to do with it in the first place.

If Bush is even partially successful in Iraq, that's good for America and bad for Kerry. There's about 10 or 15 issues I can think of off the top of my head where that same circumstance is present. I think that's close to what Clay meant, but it's what I mean in any case.

Tom S.

 

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  posted on 5/21/2004 at 04:14 PM
Think about this if you will

The Media has no problem showing these pictures 24/7 in what is clearly an effort to undermine what we are trying to accomplish in Iraq. By doing so they hope to discredit the Bush admistration therefore helping his opponent.

Consider the the religous beliefs of the people in these photos. One of the worst things for them is to have their naked bodies exposed. That is a no no. So what is the media doing? Showing these pictures to billions of people all over the world. It is not bad enough that this happened, we have to "torture" them more by showing their naked pictures to whole world OVER & OVER & OVER. Some of those people might feel more victimized by the media than the soldiers if they knew this was happening.

So now you have a case of what is Bad for america is also bad for the rest of the world but if helps Kerry beat Bush then it is OK. WTF are people thinking?





[Edited on 5/21/2004 by KCJimmy]

 

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  posted on 5/21/2004 at 05:30 PM
Incidentally, listen to the language some news networks use, they use the language of the enemy, when referring to American operations in Iraq, i.e "the Occupation." Just an observation.
 

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  posted on 5/21/2004 at 06:01 PM
--------------------------------------------------------------------------- -------------------------------------------------
Not saying they all don't lie either, they do. The problem for me with John Kerry's lies are that his brought shame, dishonor, and disgrace on a whole lot of my countrymen, some of whom were my friends, who served this nation out of a sense of duty and obligation and did so with courage and honor and in some cases thier lives. His bull **** with Hubbard and Fonda and the ensuing fraud known as Winter Soldier, were to furthur his agenda at the price of other men's honor (both living & dead) and at a cost of tainting this nations views of our Vietnam Vets and causing many to be treated with a disrepect that they did not deserve.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------- --------------------------------------------------
Derek-
with all due respect.....
He served and put his ass on the line - ( i didn't) that gives him the right as far as I'm concerned to say whatever the hell he pleases about that war or this........
george was too busy drinking and snorting and pulling on daddies sleeves for some cash and dick was home using his.......who brought disgrace upon whom?
americans have a right and duty to speak against their own gov't when it is full of sh*t........frightening that you don't seem to sense the parallels....
lies, censorship, denials, blame the soliders, not the higher ups who deliberately created the an enviorment for the iraqi prisons and now are hiding as best they can........
we are hypocrites when we profess things that we live by and violate them elsewhere.....
and unfortunately for your argument and perspective -
2 wrongs will never make a right......




[Edited on 5/21/2004 by PeachNutt]

 

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  posted on 5/21/2004 at 06:28 PM
I have no doubt this was a fabricated story, but the nevertheless.....

http://www.rushlimbaugh.com/home/daily/site_052104/content/soldier_tells_ir aq_story_you_won_t_hear_in_our_media.guest.html

 

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  posted on 5/21/2004 at 06:57 PM
At the end of the day, the people who are responsible are the officers, absolute failure of supervision. I think that's as far as it goes. They screwed up beyond measure. That being said, enough is enough already. I have seen enough of this. It really does no good to keep releasing new photos every day. It was perpetrated by a small number of morons, now it's time to move on.
 

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  posted on 5/22/2004 at 09:05 AM
i've seen enough photos - but it's not right to censor them.....and it goes to very top....
bush cheney asscroft and rumsfeld deliberatley created an enviorment for a bendiung and twisting of the rules.....hence cheneys meeting with the retired federal judges to work out what they felt was "acceptable treatment".......now it's the big oops......
i don't think it will ever be over until the guys at the top are gone........

 

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  posted on 5/22/2004 at 11:23 AM
Yeah because Cheney and the judges went, "let's torture the prisoners, that'll be acceptable and it's gonna look good when it comes out too." Please, give it a rest already.
 
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