Thread: Ridding our country of Neo-Nazi's

goldtop - 8/18/2017 at 05:31 AM

I come from a family that sent 10 people to WWII...so I have no room in my life for people who walk in the US giving the Nazi salute and yelling "Blood and soil"

The solution.....when they show up and support Nazism then the US Military should be brought in to exterminate them just as we did in WWII

Instead of innocent lives being given to renounce their ways we simply see them as enemy combatants and we send in the military to exterminate them

There is no room for the Nazi flag...the kickstep...or the Nazi salute in this country....take them out...They don't have American values and they want to spout Nazism then we deal with them just as we did in WWII


BrerRabbit - 8/18/2017 at 06:24 AM

Nazis suck.


BrerRabbit - 8/18/2017 at 06:36 AM

Hey did theo get booted? How does Muleklan keep dodging the axe, he is way worse than theo, or perryboyton who nuked.himself last year?


BrerRabbit - 8/18/2017 at 06:51 AM

If we want to get the nazis out, might as well start with the sympathizers who keep the white supremacist pressure on right here in the whipping post. It really is the one thing I can't stand in this whole ABB scene, comes from the southern rock thing, how folks regard the band as some kind of civil war confederate icon, really weird. What an insult to such a hip creative progressive force of art as the ABB. Grow up.

Ah so, that train of thought just revealed why theo is toast...

ok, never mind I just cottoned to it, had to have been that sick Big House thread. Thx for noticing, webmaster, that was pretty grim. Not cool at all.


MartinD28 - 8/18/2017 at 12:20 PM

quote:
If we want to get the nazis out, might as well start with the sympathizers who keep the white supremacist pressure on right here in the whipping post. It really is the one thing I can't stand in this whole ABB scene, comes from the southern rock thing, how folks regard the band as some kind of civil war confederate icon, really weird. What an insult to such a hip creative progressive force of art as the ABB. Grow up.

Ah so, that train of thought just revealed why theo is toast...

ok, never mind I just cottoned to it, had to have been that sick Big House thread. Thx for noticing, webmaster, that was pretty grim. Not cool at all.


Spot on, bro rabbit!


pops42 - 8/18/2017 at 02:56 PM

quote:
I come from a family that sent 10 people to WWII...so I have no room in my life for people who walk in the US giving the Nazi salute and yelling "Blood and soil"

The solution.....when they show up and support Nazism then the US Military should be brought in to exterminate them just as we did in WWII

Instead of innocent lives being given to renounce their ways we simply see them as enemy combatants and we send in the military to exterminate them

There is no room for the Nazi flag...the kickstep...or the Nazi salute in this country....take them out...They don't have American values and they want to spout Nazism then we deal with them just as we did in WWII

I agree.


PhotoRon286 - 8/18/2017 at 03:07 PM

quote:
If we want to get the nazis out, might as well start with the sympathizers who keep the white supremacist pressure on right here in the whipping post. It really is the one thing I can't stand in this whole ABB scene, comes from the southern rock thing, how folks regard the band as some kind of civil war confederate icon, really weird. What an insult to such a hip creative progressive force of art as the ABB. Grow up.

Ah so, that train of thought just revealed why theo is toast...

ok, never mind I just cottoned to it, had to have been that sick Big House thread. Thx for noticing, webmaster, that was pretty grim. Not cool at all.


Didn't see it.

Anyone got a Clift Notes summary??


goldtop - 8/18/2017 at 04:02 PM

Here's a letter I have sent to many senators and congress people


Dr Senator or Congress person

I come from a family that sent 10 people to WWII and I have no room in my life for the Nazi salute, the kick step, people marching yelling “Blood and soil” and spouting Nazi ideology. This is not a 1st amendment situation. We need to create legislation that defines Nazi groups and KKK groups as American terrorists and they should be dealt with the exact same level of commitment we do fighting ISIS or AL Queda.

A young lady died this last weekend and she should have not been the person that had to confront American terrorist. American Terrorist need to be confronted by the US military.

If we don't take these terrorist at their word then they will continue to kill innocent people who are trying to confront them unarmed.

This isn't 1st amendment rights this is people terrorizing our country spouting ideologies that were defeated in mulitple wars.

I am not a gun owner or a person who goes to these events to confront Nazi's that is the job we sent the military to do 70 years ago yet we let them march in the street under some bastardization of the 1st amendment!

If they want to be Nazi's lets confront them like we confronted Nazi's in WWII. Because if we don't innocent unarmed people will continue to die in our streets.

This is a disturbing letter I have to write to you. We have a disturbed administration that is inciting disturbed people to do disturbing things!

Truely tired of it all


Jerry - 8/18/2017 at 04:09 PM

quote:
I come from a family that sent 10 people to WWII...so I have no room in my life for people who walk in the US giving the Nazi salute and yelling "Blood and soil"

The solution.....when they show up and support Nazism then the US Military should be brought in to exterminate them just as we did in WWII

Instead of innocent lives being given to renounce their ways we simply see them as enemy combatants and we send in the military to exterminate them

There is no room for the Nazi flag...the kickstep...or the Nazi salute in this country....take them out...They don't have American values and they want to spout Nazism then we deal with them just as we did in WWII



My father, father-in-law, several uncles, a lot of cousins on both sides of my family, a lot of my older friends were, and are, WWII vets. Every Memorial Day I visit a lot of our family cemeteries and put out flags.
I don't like the Neo-Nazis or those of their ilk, don't want to hear their trash, but, as I've tried to put forward in other threads, you have to respect their freedoms as you do your own. If not, then you become the same as them. Who will protect you when others don't like your freedom of speech?


goldtop - 8/18/2017 at 04:13 PM

quote:
If we want to get the nazis out, might as well start with the sympathizers who keep the white supremacist pressure on right here in the whipping post. It really is the one thing I can't stand in this whole ABB scene, comes from the southern rock thing, how folks regard the band as some kind of civil war confederate icon, really weird. What an insult to such a hip creative progressive force of art as the ABB. Grow up.

Ah so, that train of thought just revealed why theo is toast...

ok, never mind I just cottoned to it, had to have been that sick Big House thread. Thx for noticing, webmaster, that was pretty grim. Not cool at all.


No doubt...what I want to know if they sympathize with being a confederate then if the south was to rise again will people be livestock!!! this is what it was about....The heritage they want to hold on to used people as livestock

And we should have statues of those who supported using people as Livestock???

GTF over it....denounce what was done instead of saying I proud of my heritage..say I'm sorry for what happened. We all know it can't be changed the problem is the lack of acknowledgment and a true sense of
remourse


goldtop - 8/18/2017 at 04:15 PM

quote:
quote:
I come from a family that sent 10 people to WWII...so I have no room in my life for people who walk in the US giving the Nazi salute and yelling "Blood and soil"

The solution.....when they show up and support Nazism then the US Military should be brought in to exterminate them just as we did in WWII

Instead of innocent lives being given to renounce their ways we simply see them as enemy combatants and we send in the military to exterminate them

There is no room for the Nazi flag...the kickstep...or the Nazi salute in this country....take them out...They don't have American values and they want to spout Nazism then we deal with them just as we did in WWII



My father, father-in-law, several uncles, a lot of cousins on both sides of my family, a lot of my older friends were, and are, WWII vets. Every Memorial Day I visit a lot of our family cemeteries and put out flags.
I don't like the Neo-Nazis or those of their ilk, don't want to hear their trash, but, as I've tried to put forward in other threads, you have to respect their freedoms as you do your own. If not, then you become the same as them. Who will protect you when others don't like your freedom of speech?


My speech isn't hatred of groups of people who incite violence who are terrorists..I guess you don't see them as terrorists

They re no different then ISIS


Jerry - 8/18/2017 at 04:19 PM

quote:
quote:
quote:
I come from a family that sent 10 people to WWII...so I have no room in my life for people who walk in the US giving the Nazi salute and yelling "Blood and soil"

The solution.....when they show up and support Nazism then the US Military should be brought in to exterminate them just as we did in WWII

Instead of innocent lives being given to renounce their ways we simply see them as enemy combatants and we send in the military to exterminate them

There is no room for the Nazi flag...the kickstep...or the Nazi salute in this country....take them out...They don't have American values and they want to spout Nazism then we deal with them just as we did in WWII



My father, father-in-law, several uncles, a lot of cousins on both sides of my family, a lot of my older friends were, and are, WWII vets. Every Memorial Day I visit a lot of our family cemeteries and put out flags.
I don't like the Neo-Nazis or those of their ilk, don't want to hear their trash, but, as I've tried to put forward in other threads, you have to respect their freedoms as you do your own. If not, then you become the same as them. Who will protect you when others don't like your freedom of speech?


My speech isn't hatred of groups of people who incite violence who are terrorists..I guess you don't see them as terrorists

They re no different then ISIS


Sorry, but it's kind of hard to make sense of that sentence. Could you clarify a little? You usually write more concise than this.


goldtop - 8/18/2017 at 04:24 PM

Neo-Nazi's want to bring war to the streets...because they know the only people opposing them are unarmed innocent people who they are there to terrorize

They are terrorist just like ISIS. Deal with them just like we deal with ISIS. Define them through legislation as enemy combatants just like we did the confederacy

They don't just want to speak they want to kill. But they want to kill unarmed innocent people


BrerRabbit - 8/18/2017 at 04:29 PM

Wow you actually wrote to Congress - that makes you more powerful than the entire history of the Whipping Post. Thanks man. Are you aware of the "Rule of 100" ? Politicians regard each letter as representing a 100 folks who didn't write. Count me among your 100. I want to be in that number when the saints go marchin in.

Your livestock point is well taken, it wasn't just blacks who were oppressed under that system - the majority of Southern whites were dirt poor back then and were slaughtered like cattle in the Rich Man's War for a feudalistic society that would have prevented a middle class from ever formng. I have posted this great Mark Twain quote here before, breaks it down nicely:

Mark Twain:

"...the "poor whites" of our South who were always despised, and frequently insulted, by the slave lords around them, and who owed their base condition simply to the presence of slavery in their midst, were yet pusillanimously ready to side with the slave lords in all political moves for the upholding and perpetuating of slavery, and did also finally shoulder their muskets and pour out their lives in an effort to prevent the destruction of that very institution which degraded them. And there was only one redeeming feature connected with that pitiful piece of history; and that was, that secretly the "poor white" did detest the slave lord, and did feel his own shame. That feeling was not brought to the surface, but the fact that it was there and could have been brought out, under favoring circumstances, was something--in fact it was enough; for it showed that a man is at bottom a man, after all, even if it doesn't show on the outside."
- A Connecticut Yankee in King Arthur's Court


rmack - 8/18/2017 at 04:31 PM

quote:
quote:
If we want to get the nazis out, might as well start with the sympathizers who keep the white supremacist pressure on right here in the whipping post. It really is the one thing I can't stand in this whole ABB scene, comes from the southern rock thing, how folks regard the band as some kind of civil war confederate icon, really weird. What an insult to such a hip creative progressive force of art as the ABB. Grow up.

Ah so, that train of thought just revealed why theo is toast...

ok, never mind I just cottoned to it, had to have been that sick Big House thread. Thx for noticing, webmaster, that was pretty grim. Not cool at all.


Didn't see it.

Anyone got a Clift Notes summary??



theo started a thread entitled "Time to tear down the Big House" or something similar in which he tried an absurdist approach to the removal of Confederate monuments by describing the Big House as a monument to "cultural appropriation" because the ABB had a "token" member and "culturally appropriated" "colored" music and therefore should come down. Idiotic. I responded that, of course, the Big House is a monument to what is possible in a post-Confederate, post-racist South, and then the thread vanished, evidently along with theo.


goldtop - 8/18/2017 at 04:41 PM

quote:
Wow you actually wrote to Congress - that makes you more powerful than the entire history of the Whipping Post. Thanks man. Are you aware of the "Rule of 100" ? Politicians regard each letter as representing a 100 folks who didn't write. Count me among your 100. I want to be in that number when the saints go marchin in.

Your livestock point is well taken, it wasn't just blacks who were oppressed under that system - the majority of Southern whites were dirt poor back then and were slaughtered like cattle in the Rich Man's War for a feudalistic society that would have prevented a middle class from ever formng. I have posted this great Mark Twain quote here before, breaks it down nicely:

Mark Twain:

"...the "poor whites" of our South who were always despised, and frequently insulted, by the slave lords around them, and who owed their base condition simply to the presence of slavery in their midst, were yet pusillanimously ready to side with the slave lords in all political moves for the upholding and perpetuating of slavery, and did also finally shoulder their muskets and pour out their lives in an effort to prevent the destruction of that very institution which degraded them. And there was only one redeeming feature connected with that pitiful piece of history; and that was, that secretly the "poor white" did detest the slave lord, and did feel his own shame. That feeling was not brought to the surface, but the fact that it was there and could have been brought out, under favoring circumstances, was something--in fact it was enough; for it showed that a man is at bottom a man, after all, even if it doesn't show on the outside."
- A Connecticut Yankee in King Arthur's Court



Look there needs to be a defined line between "clubs" and "terrorists"...Neo-Nazi's are not a club...the KKK is not a club

They need to be defined in legislation as "American Terrorists" as do street gangs...wanna see the end of this watch how they respond when a tank shows up and not a 35 year old woman

I would encourage everyone here to write a letter to as many senators and congress people who can think of

We need to stand up against hatred...hatred can't be hidden behind the idea of a club...you're a hate group you are an American Terrorist...round them up and send them to Guantanamo with ISIS


rmack - 8/18/2017 at 04:52 PM

quote:
quote:
I come from a family that sent 10 people to WWII...so I have no room in my life for people who walk in the US giving the Nazi salute and yelling "Blood and soil"

The solution.....when they show up and support Nazism then the US Military should be brought in to exterminate them just as we did in WWII

Instead of innocent lives being given to renounce their ways we simply see them as enemy combatants and we send in the military to exterminate them

There is no room for the Nazi flag...the kickstep...or the Nazi salute in this country....take them out...They don't have American values and they want to spout Nazism then we deal with them just as we did in WWII



My father, father-in-law, several uncles, a lot of cousins on both sides of my family, a lot of my older friends were, and are, WWII vets. Every Memorial Day I visit a lot of our family cemeteries and put out flags.
I don't like the Neo-Nazis or those of their ilk, don't want to hear their trash, but, as I've tried to put forward in other threads, you have to respect their freedoms as you do your own. If not, then you become the same as them. Who will protect you when others don't like your freedom of speech?


Here are my thoughts as to why I got into it with you previously. I felt that you greatly trivialized then and are doing it again now, an ORGANIZED invasion of armed Nazis and torchbearing Klan, maybe the largest gathering of race haters ever, into an American city, chanting the slogans of, wearing the clothing of, employing the tactics of (torches, murder - remember Heather Heyer?), and expressing admiration for (Adolf Hitler t-shirts) ideologies that went far beyond "free speech" - they actually led to the slaughter of millions of Jews, lynchings of innocents which were common practice until I was fifteen years old, and centuries of oppression and slavery. The oppression continues to this day. In the case of Nazism it took a goddam WORLD WAR to contain it. In the case of white supremacy in America, it took the goddam CIVIL WAR to contain it. Nazis were allowed to speak and operate freely in Germany, looked upon as beer-hall fringes, until one day they were in Poland, France, Italy, North Africa, Russia, Austria…if they hadn't hated Jewish physicists so much they could have easily had the bomb- they were pretty damn good at rocketry. It's not "protest" and "different opinions" - it's a murderous ideology and it's on the rise because the president and many of his advisers embrace this ideology. No need for sheets and hoods - suits and ties are fine now. No need to meet in the shadows anymore- Trump has our back.

[Edited on 8/18/2017 by rmack]


Jerry - 8/18/2017 at 04:53 PM

quote:
quote:
Wow you actually wrote to Congress - that makes you more powerful than the entire history of the Whipping Post. Thanks man. Are you aware of the "Rule of 100" ? Politicians regard each letter as representing a 100 folks who didn't write. Count me among your 100. I want to be in that number when the saints go marchin in.

Look there needs to be a defined line between "clubs" and "terrorists"...Neo-Nazi's are not a club...the KKK is not a club

They need to be defined in legislation as "American Terrorists" as do street gangs...wanna see the end of this watch how they respond when a tank shows up and not a 35 year old woman

I would encourage everyone here to write a letter to as many senators and congress people who can think of

We need to stand up against hatred...hatred can't be hidden behind the idea of a club...you're a hate group you are an American Terrorist...round them up and send them to Guantanamo with ISIS



You guys do know that Neo-Nazi groups and the KKK are legally recognized as hate groups?

Better way to stand up to them is show up on the route of their march, turn you back to them and remain silent. Show that you do not want to listen to them, and you don't acknowledge them.


rmack - 8/18/2017 at 04:56 PM

quote:
quote:
quote:
Wow you actually wrote to Congress - that makes you more powerful than the entire history of the Whipping Post. Thanks man. Are you aware of the "Rule of 100" ? Politicians regard each letter as representing a 100 folks who didn't write. Count me among your 100. I want to be in that number when the saints go marchin in.

Look there needs to be a defined line between "clubs" and "terrorists"...Neo-Nazi's are not a club...the KKK is not a club

They need to be defined in legislation as "American Terrorists" as do street gangs...wanna see the end of this watch how they respond when a tank shows up and not a 35 year old woman

I would encourage everyone here to write a letter to as many senators and congress people who can think of

We need to stand up against hatred...hatred can't be hidden behind the idea of a club...you're a hate group you are an American Terrorist...round them up and send them to Guantanamo with ISIS



You guys do know that Neo-Nazi groups and the KKK are legally recognized as hate groups?

Better way to stand up to them is show up on the route of their march, turn you back to them and remain silent. Show that you do not want to listen to them, and you don't acknowledge them.


Ignoring Nazis was already tried in Germany in the 1930s.


goldtop - 8/18/2017 at 05:00 PM

quote:
quote:
quote:
Wow you actually wrote to Congress - that makes you more powerful than the entire history of the Whipping Post. Thanks man. Are you aware of the "Rule of 100" ? Politicians regard each letter as representing a 100 folks who didn't write. Count me among your 100. I want to be in that number when the saints go marchin in.

Look there needs to be a defined line between "clubs" and "terrorists"...Neo-Nazi's are not a club...the KKK is not a club

They need to be defined in legislation as "American Terrorists" as do street gangs...wanna see the end of this watch how they respond when a tank shows up and not a 35 year old woman

I would encourage everyone here to write a letter to as many senators and congress people who can think of

We need to stand up against hatred...hatred can't be hidden behind the idea of a club...you're a hate group you are an American Terrorist...round them up and send them to Guantanamo with ISIS



You guys do know that Neo-Nazi groups and the KKK are legally recognized as hate groups?

Better way to stand up to them is show up on the route of their march, turn you back to them and remain silent. Show that you do not want to listen to them, and you don't acknowledge them.


Redefine them as American Terrorists...right know they actually just operate like a club does....except they want to bring war to the streets and the only people showing up are unarmed innocent people

And one just got ran down this weekend similar to the incident in Spain...Yet we are so ready to claim ISIS terrorist but not American Terrorists???


Jerry - 8/18/2017 at 05:01 PM

quote:
Neo-Nazi's want to bring war to the streets...because they know the only people opposing them are unarmed innocent people who they are there to terrorize

They are terrorist just like ISIS. Deal with them just like we deal with ISIS. Define them through legislation as enemy combatants just like we did the confederacy

They don't just want to speak they want to kill. But they want to kill unarmed innocent people


In another thread I joined the complaints on the police. They should not have allowed either side to be armed, have spray cans that were used as impromptu flame throwers, bats, poles, paint ball guns, and should have made all protestors remove protective gear (shields, gas masks, helmets, body armor) before any protests were scheduled to start.

https://www.usatoday.com/story/news/2017/08/12/charlottesville-protetst-wha t-we-know-now/562372001/

Watch the video of the car crash, then scroll down and check out the photos.


goldtop - 8/18/2017 at 05:04 PM

quote:
quote:
Neo-Nazi's want to bring war to the streets...because they know the only people opposing them are unarmed innocent people who they are there to terrorize

They are terrorist just like ISIS. Deal with them just like we deal with ISIS. Define them through legislation as enemy combatants just like we did the confederacy

They don't just want to speak they want to kill. But they want to kill unarmed innocent people


In another thread I joined the complaints on the police. They should not have allowed either side to be armed, have spray cans that were used as impromptu flame throwers, bats, poles, paint ball guns, and should have made all protestors remove protective gear (shields, gas masks, helmets, body armor) before any protests were scheduled to start.

https://www.usatoday.com/story/news/2017/08/12/charlottesville-protetst-wha t-we-know-now/562372001/

Watch the video of the car crash, then scroll down and check out the photos.


If people want to protest then they shouldn't be bringing any kind of weapons....that is where the line between the 1st amendment gets crossed

All those Neo-Nazi's and KKK came weaponize....their 1st amendment rights don't speak anymore when violence is the reason you assemble


goldtop - 8/18/2017 at 05:07 PM

People on the other side should not feel the need to have weapons either but again they shouldn't be the ones confronting American Terrorists


Jerry - 8/18/2017 at 05:09 PM

quote:
quote:
quote:
Neo-Nazi's want to bring war to the streets...because they know the only people opposing them are unarmed innocent people who they are there to terrorize

They are terrorist just like ISIS. Deal with them just like we deal with ISIS. Define them through legislation as enemy combatants just like we did the confederacy

They don't just want to speak they want to kill. But they want to kill unarmed innocent people


In another thread I joined the complaints on the police. They should not have allowed either side to be armed, have spray cans that were used as impromptu flame throwers, bats, poles, paint ball guns, and should have made all protestors remove protective gear (shields, gas masks, helmets, body armor) before any protests were scheduled to start.

https://www.usatoday.com/story/news/2017/08/12/charlottesville-protetst-wha t-we-know-now/562372001/

Watch the video of the car crash, then scroll down and check out the photos.


If people want to protest then they shouldn't be bringing any kind of weapons....that is where the line between the 1st amendment gets crossed

All those Neo-Nazi's and KKK came weaponize....their 1st amendment rights don't speak anymore when violence is the reason you assemble


They weren't the only ones who came with weapons.


goldtop - 8/18/2017 at 05:11 PM

quote:
quote:
quote:
quote:
Neo-Nazi's want to bring war to the streets...because they know the only people opposing them are unarmed innocent people who they are there to terrorize

They are terrorist just like ISIS. Deal with them just like we deal with ISIS. Define them through legislation as enemy combatants just like we did the confederacy

They don't just want to speak they want to kill. But they want to kill unarmed innocent people


In another thread I joined the complaints on the police. They should not have allowed either side to be armed, have spray cans that were used as impromptu flame throwers, bats, poles, paint ball guns, and should have made all protestors remove protective gear (shields, gas masks, helmets, body armor) before any protests were scheduled to start.

https://www.usatoday.com/story/news/2017/08/12/charlottesville-protetst-wha t-we-know-now/562372001/

Watch the video of the car crash, then scroll down and check out the photos.


If people want to protest then they shouldn't be bringing any kind of weapons....that is where the line between the 1st amendment gets crossed

All those Neo-Nazi's and KKK came weaponize....their 1st amendment rights don't speak anymore when violence is the reason you assemble


They weren't the only ones who came with weapons.



Do you think the protesters of the American Terrorists groups would have been weaponize if they didn't already know of the threat...and again they shouldn't be the ones confronting the American terrorist


Jerry - 8/18/2017 at 05:14 PM

quote:
quote:
quote:
quote:
quote:
Neo-Nazi's want to bring war to the streets...because they know the only people opposing them are unarmed innocent people who they are there to terrorize

They are terrorist just like ISIS. Deal with them just like we deal with ISIS. Define them through legislation as enemy combatants just like we did the confederacy

They don't just want to speak they want to kill. But they want to kill unarmed innocent people


In another thread I joined the complaints on the police. They should not have allowed either side to be armed, have spray cans that were used as impromptu flame throwers, bats, poles, paint ball guns, and should have made all protestors remove protective gear (shields, gas masks, helmets, body armor) before any protests were scheduled to start.

https://www.usatoday.com/story/news/2017/08/12/charlottesville-protetst-wha t-we-know-now/562372001/

Watch the video of the car crash, then scroll down and check out the photos.


If people want to protest then they shouldn't be bringing any kind of weapons....that is where the line between the 1st amendment gets crossed

All those Neo-Nazi's and KKK came weaponize....their 1st amendment rights don't speak anymore when violence is the reason you assemble


They weren't the only ones who came with weapons.



Do you think the protesters of the American Terrorists groups would have been weaponize if they didn't already know of the threat...and again they shouldn't be the ones confronting the American terrorist




That's why I said the police should have taken all the weapons away.


emr - 8/18/2017 at 05:14 PM

Mark Twain was ahead of his time; but also of his time. Used the n word throughout guck Finn. His statues; down or up?

General Custer was a union hero at Gettysburg; but not to the native Americans. His statues; up or down?

It gets complicated real fast.

Palestinians call for death to Israel. BDS movement is legal to the best of my knowledge

Free speech is free speech


goldtop - 8/18/2017 at 05:19 PM

quote:
quote:
quote:
quote:
quote:
quote:
Neo-Nazi's want to bring war to the streets...because they know the only people opposing them are unarmed innocent people who they are there to terrorize

They are terrorist just like ISIS. Deal with them just like we deal with ISIS. Define them through legislation as enemy combatants just like we did the confederacy

They don't just want to speak they want to kill. But they want to kill unarmed innocent people


In another thread I joined the complaints on the police. They should not have allowed either side to be armed, have spray cans that were used as impromptu flame throwers, bats, poles, paint ball guns, and should have made all protestors remove protective gear (shields, gas masks, helmets, body armor) before any protests were scheduled to start.

https://www.usatoday.com/story/news/2017/08/12/charlottesville-protetst-wha t-we-know-now/562372001/

Watch the video of the car crash, then scroll down and check out the photos.


If people want to protest then they shouldn't be bringing any kind of weapons....that is where the line between the 1st amendment gets crossed

All those Neo-Nazi's and KKK came weaponize....their 1st amendment rights don't speak anymore when violence is the reason you assemble


They weren't the only ones who came with weapons.



Do you think the protesters of the American Terrorists groups would have been weaponize if they didn't already know of the threat...and again they shouldn't be the ones confronting the American terrorist




That's why I said the police should have taken all the weapons away.


I agree...why did the American Terrorist bring weapons in the first place if all they wanted to do was speak??

See if you come unarmed there might be less chance of violence...Once they are armed the 1st amendment goes out the window


goldtop - 8/18/2017 at 05:21 PM

quote:
Mark Twain was ahead of his time; but also of his time. Used the n word throughout guck Finn. His statues; down or up?

General Custer was a union hero at Gettysburg; but not to the native Americans. His statues; up or down?

It gets complicated real fast.

Palestinians call for death to Israel. BDS movement is legal to the best of my knowledge

Free speech is free speech


The difference is these groups want a war...but only with the innocent and unarmed and they want to stand behind the 1st amendment in the process???

Speak loud and clear...but don't incite violence


goldtop - 8/18/2017 at 05:30 PM

Here's Arnold's message to Nazi's the KKK and all hate groups

https://www.facebook.com/attn/videos/1475398805828907/


BoytonBrother - 8/18/2017 at 05:32 PM

Goldtop, get a grip. Do you realize you are calling for the murder of hundreds of people who are only guilty of saying horrible things? As disgusting as they are, you are 100% in the wrong for suggesting that the US arrest/prosecute/kill them - if that's what you want, then you don't want America. The murderer with the car has been arrested - justice is being served. Many of us have relatives that fought in wars and we don't fly off the handle writing our congressman to hunt them down. You may not like it, but the 1st amendment is clear.


emr - 8/18/2017 at 05:35 PM

It's still not a crime till committed. Johnny Depp threatens to kill trump

It's either free speech for both sides or for neither


goldtop - 8/18/2017 at 05:36 PM

quote:
Goldtop, get a grip. Do you realize you are calling for the murder of hundreds of people who are only guilty of saying horrible things? As disgusting as they are, you are 100% in the wrong for suggesting that the US arrest/prosecute/kill them - if that's what you want, then you don't want America. The murderer with the car has been arrested - justice is being served. Many of us have relatives that fought in wars and we don't fly off the handle writing our congressman to hunt them down. You may not like it, but the 1st amendment is clear.


They can say what they want...they want to kill someone and they did this week

[Edited on 8/18/2017 by goldtop]


goldtop - 8/18/2017 at 05:39 PM

If you see these groups as any different than ISIS I'm saying I don't....we all have the right to spout hate if we so choose....we don't have the right to bring weapons and try to kill innocent people


BoytonBrother - 8/18/2017 at 05:42 PM

You cannot lump the terrorist driver in with the entire group unless they planned it that way. Neo nazis have been here forever - watch the movie "American History X". They have never been a true threat and never will be. If a fringe group wants to remain here, they can, as long as they don't commit crime. The driver is a terrorist and should be prosecuted as such, but if the main group had nothing to do with the driver, then it's wrong to call the entire group terrorists. I hate them too but there should not be any legal action taken against them. To suggest it is un-American and only fuels their fire, and gives the right ammunition to use against the left. There are obviously much better ways, especially versus a tiny fringe group that can't influence sh*t.


emr - 8/18/2017 at 05:42 PM

If the driver came to the rally with a plan to drive into the crowd I agree. If it was spontaneous reaction to the situation I don't agree. I have no problem with the govt violating any of my privatize to head off planned attacks by anyone


goldtop - 8/18/2017 at 05:45 PM

quote:
You cannot lump the terrorist driver in with the entire group unless they planned it that way. Neo nazis have been here forever - watch the movie "American History X". They have never been a true threat and never will be. If a fringe group wants to remain here, they can, as long as they don't commit crime. The driver is a terrorist and should be prosecuted as such, but if the main group had nothing to do with the driver, then it's wrong to call the entire group terrorists. I hate them too but there should not be any legal action taken against them. To suggest it is un-American and only fuels their fire, and gives the right ammunition to use against the left. There are obviously much better ways, especially versus a tiny fringe group that can't influence sh*t.


When he ran the car into the woman all of the neo-nazis/hate groups should have been arrested with him as accessories to the crime...they all participated so they should have all been arrested

Speak loud and clear....don't come armed and say this is my 1st amendment right because that is an unlawful assembly...we also can't yell fire in a building full of people...there are limits to the 1st amendment


goldtop - 8/18/2017 at 05:48 PM

They can use facebook....YouTube....Instagram....twitter,.....and they can stand in apublic square and "say" what they want

When you physically incite violence in the name of an ideology you are now a terrorist


BoytonBrother - 8/18/2017 at 06:35 PM

quote:
When he ran the car into the woman all of the neo-nazis/hate groups should have been arrested with him as accessories to the crime...they all participated so they should have all been arrested


How did they participate in the murder? Please cite sources that back your claims.


goldtop - 8/18/2017 at 06:44 PM

quote:
quote:
When he ran the car into the woman all of the neo-nazis/hate groups should have been arrested with him as accessories to the crime...they all participated so they should have all been arrested


How did they participate in the murder? Please cite sources that back your claims.


Since they all came weaponized they didn't come to speak they came to incite violence. They must have all colluded to have weapons so that would be conspiracy. There was violence the night before the next day should have been banned right then.

The next day they again came with weapons so they didn't come to exercise their 1st amendment rights they came again as terrorist and they are all culpable for whatever injuries and death that happened.

This was planned by this so called "hate group"...they have many platforms to spout what they want...this was an attempt to bring their war to the streets and they succeeded

On top of that they were given pats on the back by DT

ISIS goes into neighborhoods and kills innocent people based on an ideology

Those "hate groups" did the same thing


Jerry - 8/18/2017 at 06:45 PM

quote:
They can use facebook....YouTube....Instagram....twitter,.....and they can stand in apublic square and "say" what they want

When you physically incite violence in the name of an ideology you are now a terrorist


What ideology was being promoted?

I think your sig tells a lot about you: "Believing is alright, just don't believe in the wrong thing"

I guess it's funny that I have more liberal thinking than some of the liberals on this site.


goldtop - 8/18/2017 at 06:52 PM

quote:
quote:
They can use facebook....YouTube....Instagram....twitter,.....and they can stand in apublic square and "say" what they want

When you physically incite violence in the name of an ideology you are now a terrorist


What ideology was being promoted?

I think your sig tells a lot about you: "Believing is alright, just don't believe in the wrong thing"

I guess it's funny that I have more liberal thinking than some of the liberals on this site.


Neo-Nazi is an ideology just as ISIS is an ideology...they came to fight for their ideology not speak. The other people have the right to defend themselves when the terrorist go from speaking to fighting

[Edited on 8/18/2017 by goldtop]


Bhawk - 8/18/2017 at 06:52 PM

quote:
Mark Twain was ahead of his time; but also of his time. Used the n word throughout guck Finn. His statues; down or up?

General Custer was a union hero at Gettysburg; but not to the native Americans. His statues; up or down?

It gets complicated real fast.

Palestinians call for death to Israel. BDS movement is legal to the best of my knowledge

Free speech is free speech


Free speech is not absolute.


BrerRabbit - 8/18/2017 at 06:56 PM

quote:
General Custer was a union hero at Gettysburg; but not to the native Americans. His statues; up or down?


Down.


rmack - 8/18/2017 at 07:03 PM

quote:
quote:
They can use facebook....YouTube....Instagram....twitter,.....and they can stand in apublic square and "say" what they want

When you physically incite violence in the name of an ideology you are now a terrorist


What ideology was being promoted?

I think your sig tells a lot about you: "Believing is alright, just don't believe in the wrong thing"

I guess it's funny that I have more liberal thinking than some of the liberals on this site.


What ideology is being promoted!? Again…

Here are my thoughts as to why I got into it with you previously. I felt that you greatly trivialized then and are doing it again now, an ORGANIZED invasion of armed Nazis and torchbearing Klan, maybe the largest gathering of race haters ever, into an American city, chanting the slogans of, wearing the clothing of, employing the tactics of (torches, murder - remember Heather Heyer?), and expressing admiration for (Adolf Hitler t-shirts) ideologies that went far beyond "free speech" - they actually led to the slaughter of millions of Jews, lynchings of innocents which were common practice until I was fifteen years old, and centuries of oppression and slavery. The oppression continues to this day. In the case of Nazism it took a goddam WORLD WAR to contain it. In the case of white supremacy in America, it took the goddam CIVIL WAR to contain it. Nazis were allowed to speak and operate freely in Germany, looked upon as beer-hall fringes, until one day they were in Poland, France, Italy, North Africa, Russia, Austria…if they hadn't hated Jewish physicists so much they could have easily had the bomb- they were pretty damn good at rocketry. It's not "protest" and "different opinions" - it's a murderous ideology and it's on the rise because the president and many of his advisers embrace this ideology. No need for sheets and hoods - suits and ties are fine now. No need to meet in the shadows anymore- Trump has our back.


rmack - 8/18/2017 at 07:14 PM

quote:
quote:
They can use facebook....YouTube....Instagram....twitter,.....and they can stand in apublic square and "say" what they want

When you physically incite violence in the name of an ideology you are now a terrorist


What ideology was being promoted?

I think your sig tells a lot about you: "Believing is alright, just don't believe in the wrong thing"

I guess it's funny that I have more liberal thinking than some of the liberals on this site.


The ideology that whites are the master race, so superior that they are justified in murdering millions of Jews. This went beyond ideology to action - it actually happened. The ideology that whites are superior to blacks, so much so that it is fine to buy, sell and enslave them. This went beyond ideology into action - this actually happened. The ideology that it is right to use terror and murder to suppress and oppress based on race. This goes beyond ideology - it actually happened and is still happening.


goldtop - 8/18/2017 at 07:19 PM

quote:
quote:
quote:
They can use facebook....YouTube....Instagram....twitter,.....and they can stand in apublic square and "say" what they want

When you physically incite violence in the name of an ideology you are now a terrorist


What ideology was being promoted?

I think your sig tells a lot about you: "Believing is alright, just don't believe in the wrong thing"

I guess it's funny that I have more liberal thinking than some of the liberals on this site.


What ideology is being promoted!? Again…

Here are my thoughts as to why I got into it with you previously. I felt that you greatly trivialized then and are doing it again now, an ORGANIZED invasion of armed Nazis and torchbearing Klan, maybe the largest gathering of race haters ever, into an American city, chanting the slogans of, wearing the clothing of, employing the tactics of (torches, murder - remember Heather Heyer?), and expressing admiration for (Adolf Hitler t-shirts) ideologies that went far beyond "free speech" - they actually led to the slaughter of millions of Jews, lynchings of innocents which were common practice until I was fifteen years old, and centuries of oppression and slavery. The oppression continues to this day. In the case of Nazism it took a goddam WORLD WAR to contain it. In the case of white supremacy in America, it took the goddam CIVIL WAR to contain it. Nazis were allowed to speak and operate freely in Germany, looked upon as beer-hall fringes, until one day they were in Poland, France, Italy, North Africa, Russia, Austria…if they hadn't hated Jewish physicists so much they could have easily had the bomb- they were pretty damn good at rocketry. It's not "protest" and "different opinions" - it's a murderous ideology and it's on the rise because the president and many of his advisers embrace this ideology. No need for sheets and hoods - suits and ties are fine now. No need to meet in the shadows anymore- Trump has our back.



I think because these are American citizens we have a hard time defining them for what they really are "Terrorist" just as ISIS is a terrorist organization.

I have no problem with free speech....they didn't come to speak...they came to fight as Nazi's so we should take the fight they want to them with them same commitment we did in Europe.

They can march....scream......make video's....use social media to say what they want.....they can't come to fight and if they do it shouldn't be innocent civilians there to confront them...

They want a Nazi level war...give it to them...treat them as war criminals and send them away....

The weren't speaking go look at the videos


BillyBlastoff - 8/18/2017 at 07:37 PM

I heard the Black Lives Matter organization described as a terrorist organization. All they are saying is, "please Mr. Policeman... stop killing black people." The truth is a bunch of cops have murdered a bunch of black people with apparently no cause. Because of systematic racism built into many American police departments the cops got away with murder.

Now I hear those same people who described BLM as a terrorist organization support the mission of white supremacist. A mission that entails wiping out all people of color.

You can't yell "FIRE" in a crowded theater. Calling for the eradication of people because of their race is not protected speech.

The antifascist who demonstrated in Charlottesville are not the same as the filthy Nazi animals that advocate for a superior race.


BillyBlastoff - 8/18/2017 at 07:41 PM

Here's a good example of free speech:

https://www.washingtonpost.com/local/known-racist-and-a-nazi-sympathizer-ac tivist-projects-message-onto-trumps-dc-hotel/2017/08/18/9726a6c0-8413-11e7- 902a-2a9f2d808496_story.html?hpid=hp_local-news_trumphotel-1045am%3Ahomepag e%2Fstory&utm_term=.8240fb281731


BoytonBrother - 8/18/2017 at 07:46 PM

quote:
they didn't come to speak...they came to fight


Can you provide evidence of this? The presence of weapons is not evidence, especially if they are registered.


goldtop - 8/18/2017 at 07:54 PM

quote:
quote:
they didn't come to speak...they came to fight


Can you provide evidence of this? The presence of weapons is not evidence, especially if they are registered.


They all came with Tiki torches, most had clubs and shields and many had frozen bottles of water they threw into the crowd...and of course one of them ran a car into a a group of people killing a woman who wasn't armed

Have you watched the videos of the night before and the videos of that day? because it's clear they all had a plan before they arrived or they all wouldn't have had tiki torches that isn't a coincidence

Show me how they came to just speak?? Why is it hard to see some American citizens as terrorists?? when they are/ Its sad for sure and hard to swallow that we can bred these here but it needs a light shown on it right now


BillyBlastoff - 8/18/2017 at 08:00 PM

quote:
quote:
they didn't come to speak...they came to fight


Can you provide evidence of this? The presence of weapons is not evidence, especially if they are registered.


What about the shields and helmets? Can you even register riot gear?

https://www.buzzfeed.com/blakemontgomery/heres-what-really-happened-in-char lottesville?utm_term=.pqywePoBXQ#.dm6Eed8pK3


emr - 8/18/2017 at 08:13 PM

quote:
I heard the Black Lives Matter organization described as a terrorist organization. All they are saying is, "please Mr. Policeman... stop killing black people." The truth is a bunch of cops have murdered a bunch of black people with apparently no cause. Because of systematic racism built into many American police departments the cops got away with murder.

Now I hear those same people who described BLM as a terrorist organization support the mission of white supremacist. A mission that entails wiping out all people of color.

You can't yell "FIRE" in a crowded theater. Calling for the eradication of people because of their race is not protected speech.

The antifascist who demonstrated in Charlottesville are not the same as the filthy Nazi animals that advocate for a superior race.


Who support their mission? It's all a question of the limits of free speech. It is clear you can't yell fire in a crowded theater; it is not clear when hate-mongering in public is allowed/not allowed. I can live in any system but hippocracy. Again; can Johnny Depp call for the assassination of Trump? Its just a goose gander thing.


emr - 8/18/2017 at 08:16 PM

quote:
quote:
General Custer was a union hero at Gettysburg; but not to the native Americans. His statues; up or down?


Down.



I guess this starts a whole new movement? Native American Lives matter more than Black lives?


BoytonBrother - 8/18/2017 at 08:38 PM

quote:
They all came with Tiki torches, most had clubs and shields and many had frozen bottles of water they threw into the crowd...


Then they are nothing like ISIS.

quote:
and of course one of them ran a car into a a group of people killing a woman who wasn't armed


Now this POS is like ISIS.

quote:
Have you watched the videos of the night before and the videos of that day? because it's clear they all had a plan before they arrived or they all wouldn't have had tiki torches that isn't a coincidence


I saw the tiki torches as a hilarious, sad, and pathetic way to try to intimidate and look scary. They failed. What a bunch of idiots.

quote:
Show me how they came to just speak?? Why is it hard to see some American citizens as terrorists?? when they are/ Its sad for sure and hard to swallow that we can bred these here but it needs a light shown on it right now


I have no problem calling other Americans "terrorists", like the driver and our mass shooters. But until there's proof that they threw the first punch or object, then I cannot call them terrorists - just a small fringe group of backwards lost souls. I'd support putting them on a list and having them surveilled - that would be as extreme as I go. And again, I think they are a disgrace to our country, and lower than animals. But if we take lethal/legal action for them gathering, then I'd be afraid some far-right future leader might do that to a liberal gathering. To beat them, we cannot produce any ammunition against ourselves that might hinder progress.


goldtop - 8/18/2017 at 08:54 PM

You need to go research what their goal is and come to terms that they achieved it that day.

They didn't come to speak the guy in the car was not the only terrorist....They were all terrorist...the fact that the Tiki's were used was a sign of how they felt it was a symbol of their terrorism....go ask if the crowd felt terrorized

the fact that you don't is irrelevant...go see what the Rabbi said as he stood outside and watched what they did

They attacked a group of clergy singing...they weren't being violent...you obviously haven't seen the videos


Bhawk - 8/18/2017 at 09:07 PM

quote:
quote:
I heard the Black Lives Matter organization described as a terrorist organization. All they are saying is, "please Mr. Policeman... stop killing black people." The truth is a bunch of cops have murdered a bunch of black people with apparently no cause. Because of systematic racism built into many American police departments the cops got away with murder.

Now I hear those same people who described BLM as a terrorist organization support the mission of white supremacist. A mission that entails wiping out all people of color.

You can't yell "FIRE" in a crowded theater. Calling for the eradication of people because of their race is not protected speech.

The antifascist who demonstrated in Charlottesville are not the same as the filthy Nazi animals that advocate for a superior race.


Who support their mission? It's all a question of the limits of free speech. It is clear you can't yell fire in a crowded theater; it is not clear when hate-mongering in public is allowed/not allowed. I can live in any system but hippocracy. Again; can Johnny Depp call for the assassination of Trump? Its just a goose gander thing.


Johnny Depp made that comment in England. If he had made it here, most likely he would have heard from the Secret Service.


Bhawk - 8/18/2017 at 09:10 PM

quote:
quote:
quote:
General Custer was a union hero at Gettysburg; but not to the native Americans. His statues; up or down?


Down.



I guess this starts a whole new movement? Native American Lives matter more than Black lives?


The fact that people keep putting Nazis on the same level as BLM is very telling.


goldtop - 8/18/2017 at 09:28 PM

Here is the dictionary definition of terrorism

ter·ror·ism
ˈterəˌrizəm/
noun
noun: terrorism

the unlawful use of violence and intimidation, especially against civilians, in the pursuit of political aims.

That rally falls exactly in the definition above and so do all the Neo-Nazi/KKK hate groups participants who showed up to fight for their political aim


emr - 8/18/2017 at 10:50 PM

quote:
quote:
quote:
quote:
General Custer was a union hero at Gettysburg; but not to the native Americans. His statues; up or down?


Down.



I guess this starts a whole new movement? Native American Lives matter more than Black lives?


The fact that people keep putting Nazis on the same level as BLM is very telling.


Think you misunderstood me. Was just pointing out (in what I thought was a somewhat humorous manner) that the issue is not always simple. Custer was on the right side of the Civil war; but surely not pro native American. How do you decide what to do with his statue? General Lee was Lincoln's first choice to head the Union Army. He refused mostly because he refused to raise arms against fellow Virginians.

Believe me I have no use for Nazi's; believe that all lives matter


BrerRabbit - 8/18/2017 at 11:05 PM

quote:
I guess this starts a whole new movement?


No need. The American Indian Movement has been around since Columbus. Good revival since the 1970s. Have done a good job too.



Jerry - 8/20/2017 at 01:49 AM

quote:
quote:
quote:
They can use facebook....YouTube....Instagram....twitter,.....and they can stand in apublic square and "say" what they want

When you physically incite violence in the name of an ideology you are now a terrorist


What ideology was being promoted?

I think your sig tells a lot about you: "Believing is alright, just don't believe in the wrong thing"

I guess it's funny that I have more liberal thinking than some of the liberals on this site.


What ideology is being promoted!? Again…

Here are my thoughts as to why I got into it with you previously. I felt that you greatly trivialized then and are doing it again now, an ORGANIZED invasion of armed Nazis and torchbearing Klan, maybe the largest gathering of race haters ever, into an American city, chanting the slogans of, wearing the clothing of, employing the tactics of (torches, murder - remember Heather Heyer?), and expressing admiration for (Adolf Hitler t-shirts) ideologies that went far beyond "free speech" - they actually led to the slaughter of millions of Jews, lynchings of innocents which were common practice until I was fifteen years old, and centuries of oppression and slavery. The oppression continues to this day. In the case of Nazism it took a goddam WORLD WAR to contain it. In the case of white supremacy in America, it took the goddam CIVIL WAR to contain it. Nazis were allowed to speak and operate freely in Germany, looked upon as beer-hall fringes, until one day they were in Poland, France, Italy, North Africa, Russia, Austria…if they hadn't hated Jewish physicists so much they could have easily had the bomb- they were pretty damn good at rocketry. It's not "protest" and "different opinions" - it's a murderous ideology and it's on the rise because the president and many of his advisers embrace this ideology. No need for sheets and hoods - suits and ties are fine now. No need to meet in the shadows anymore- Trump has our back.



This tells me that you have yet to understand what I have been saying.
Believe me, i probably know more of what happened during WWII than most of you. Virtually every aunt and uncle had the "shadow box" with the folded flag and the decorations of a son or husband who was killed in the war. My father was 100% disabled during the Battle of the Bulge. Uncles on both sides of my family that have died since 1945 have the veterans gravestones.

So don't start lecturing me about WWII. I'll ask you a question and let you think about it (actually 2).

Why did the soldiers go off to fight?
What protections of the Constitution has every soldier fought for since 1789?


emr - 8/20/2017 at 09:24 PM

quote:
quote:
I guess this starts a whole new movement?


No need. The American Indian Movement has been around since Columbus. Good revival since the 1970s. Have done a good job too.





I'm being dead serious; not being an a-hole. Symbol wasn't changed to Native American Movement?


BrerRabbit - 8/20/2017 at 10:12 PM

You have a point. But if you comb your hair over it, it might not show.


goldtop - 8/20/2017 at 10:40 PM

Neo-Confederate Ideology: Allow those states who wish to use people as livestock to do so. They want a dominant white society where only white people can vote...there will be designated areas where people of color can sit, eat, drink, pee, poop....etc....They want the right to treat other humans as animals. Including whipping, maiming and killing if those livestock rebel against any other option. That also include people who are of the Catholic faith and many other people who don't follow Anglo-Saxon religious beliefs

This is what the people of the south want to hold on to as a "heritage" instead of acknowledgment of the crimes and a remorseful apology

Neo-Nazi Ideology: To have a supreme white dominant race that controls everything. Extermination of Jews, Gays, people with any mental or extreme physical disabilities or any person of color.

Did we really have to spell out the Ideology of hate

The flags they fly represent those ideologies

[Edited on 8/20/2017 by goldtop]


BrerRabbit - 8/21/2017 at 12:51 AM

OK, well need some advice here. Am doing an art gallery show of portraits of Nazis.

Should I hang them or line them up against the wall?


Jerry - 8/21/2017 at 01:12 AM

quote:
Neo-Confederate Ideology: Allow those states who wish to use people as livestock to do so. They want a dominant white society where only white people can vote...there will be designated areas where people of color can sit, eat, drink, pee, poop....etc....They want the right to treat other humans as animals. Including whipping, maiming and killing if those livestock rebel against any other option. That also include people who are of the Catholic faith and many other people who don't follow Anglo-Saxon religious beliefs

This is what the people of the south want to hold on to as a "heritage" instead of acknowledgment of the crimes and a remorseful apology

Neo-Nazi Ideology: To have a supreme white dominant race that controls everything. Extermination of Jews, Gays, people with any mental or extreme physical disabilities or any person of color.

Did we really have to spell out the Ideology of hate

The flags they fly represent those ideologies

[Edited on 8/20/2017 by goldtop]


I've never met anyone who owns a slave. I've never owned a slave. No one in the south owns slaves.
So what crime are you talking about? Are you applying modern day morals to to those who lived in the 17th to 19th century?

If so, I don't think they can hear you bitch and moan about what they did back then, since they're all dead.

Would you be ok if someone took away mementos/heirlooms from your ancestors?
Are you ok with eradication of the past?
Try the rule we used in the old ABB Listserve. Wait 24 hours before you post about anything that made you angry. Think, then post.


goldtop - 8/21/2017 at 02:17 AM

None of my ancestors are traitors....If they were I wouldn't be making excuses about what they did. I would acknowledge the crimes with a remorsefully apologize and never raise the flag of treason again.

The fact that no one in the south owns slave is because that ideology was defeated yet you think we should celebrate the acts of treason and slavery and wave a flag that represents that and have monuments celebrating the leaders

How about they just fly the American flag....not the flag of treason

Now if you can't come to terms with the facts that's another issue

[Edited on 8/21/2017 by goldtop]


Bhawk - 8/21/2017 at 03:20 PM

quote:
Are you ok with eradication of the past?


Taking down a statue does not eradication of any past make.

I learned that in Statue Class junior year of high school.


BoytonBrother - 8/21/2017 at 03:43 PM

Since there are many different ways to honor a heritage, why must their method involve ditching the American flag for some other? How is this different than what Colin Kaepernick has done? I sure hope the confederate flag loyalists aren't criticizing him, otherwise that would be the ultimate hypocrisy.


goldtop - 8/21/2017 at 03:53 PM

quote:
Since there are many different ways to honor a heritage, why must their method involve ditching the American flag for some other? How is this different than what Colin Kaepernick has done? I sure hope the confederate flag loyalists aren't criticizing him, otherwise that would be the ultimate hypocrisy.


I don't get it either. Since the end of the Civil war they have yet to acknowledge the crimes with a passionate remorseful apology and instead they stand in defiance while they wave the flag that supported the ideology of slavery.

We know we can't change the past but to heal from it always take acknowledgement and a remorseful apology.

You aren't confederates anymore and you haven't been since 1865. Support the American flag and American values. That doesn't mean you can't be proud of being from the south...It takes a bigger person to acknowledge the wrongs and seek forgiveness than to stand in defiance and continue to wave the flag


Jerry - 8/22/2017 at 01:50 PM

quote:
quote:
Since there are many different ways to honor a heritage, why must their method involve ditching the American flag for some other? How is this different than what Colin Kaepernick has done? I sure hope the confederate flag loyalists aren't criticizing him, otherwise that would be the ultimate hypocrisy.


I don't get it either. Since the end of the Civil war they have yet to acknowledge the crimes with a passionate remorseful apology and instead they stand in defiance while they wave the flag that supported the ideology of slavery.
___________________________________________________________________________ _____________

And what crimes would that be? Again, you are applying present day laws to the 1600's to late 1800's.
Why should anyone apologize for something that happen over 150 years ago.
Slavery happened under the British, French, Spanish, and later, American flag before the Confederacy was formed. So which flag are you referring to. They all represent slavery.
___________________________________________________________________________ _____________

We know we can't change the past but to heal from it always take acknowledgement and a remorseful apology.
___________________________________________________________________________ _____________

Again, read above response.
___________________________________________________________________________ _____________

You aren't confederates anymore and you haven't been since 1865. Support the American flag and American values. That doesn't mean you can't be proud of being from the south...It takes a bigger person to acknowledge the wrongs and seek forgiveness than to stand in defiance and continue to wave the flag

___________________________________________________________________________ _____________

So you will quit flying the American flag?

It is you who is not embracing American values. Freedom of speech, freedom of protest, freedom of expression, the freedom of equal protection under the law, all seem to be only your freedoms and not others.

Learn history before you start to jump up on your soapbox.

Learn history before you condemn others.


BoytonBrother - 8/22/2017 at 02:50 PM

For the record, I want us all to do whatever the hell we want to do without a hostile reaction from our peers. Fly the confederate flag, kneel during the anthem, do whatever you need to do as long as you are not hurting or having an adverse material affect on anyone. No need to agree on it - just have to be civil about it. The problem begins, not with the flag waving or the kneeling, but when the masses on both sides go into hysteria attack mode.


BrerRabbit - 8/22/2017 at 03:15 PM

quote:
The fact that people keep putting Nazis on the same level as BLM is very telliing


Nazi Lives Matter.


2112 - 8/22/2017 at 03:26 PM

Nothing says "I'm proud to be from the south" more than flying a flag representing a war you lost.


BrerRabbit - 8/22/2017 at 03:33 PM

Hey 2112 have you read Confederates In the Attic by Tony Horowitz?


Muleman1994 - 8/22/2017 at 03:45 PM

quote:
quote:
quote:
Since there are many different ways to honor a heritage, why must their method involve ditching the American flag for some other? How is this different than what Colin Kaepernick has done? I sure hope the confederate flag loyalists aren't criticizing him, otherwise that would be the ultimate hypocrisy.


I don't get it either. Since the end of the Civil war they have yet to acknowledge the crimes with a passionate remorseful apology and instead they stand in defiance while they wave the flag that supported the ideology of slavery.
___________________________________________________________________________ _____________

And what crimes would that be? Again, you are applying present day laws to the 1600's to late 1800's.
Why should anyone apologize for something that happen over 150 years ago.
Slavery happened under the British, French, Spanish, and later, American flag before the Confederacy was formed. So which flag are you referring to. They all represent slavery.
___________________________________________________________________________ _____________

We know we can't change the past but to heal from it always take acknowledgement and a remorseful apology.
___________________________________________________________________________ _____________

Again, read above response.
___________________________________________________________________________ _____________

You aren't confederates anymore and you haven't been since 1865. Support the American flag and American values. That doesn't mean you can't be proud of being from the south...It takes a bigger person to acknowledge the wrongs and seek forgiveness than to stand in defiance and continue to wave the flag

___________________________________________________________________________ _____________

So you will quit flying the American flag?

It is you who is not embracing American values. Freedom of speech, freedom of protest, freedom of expression, the freedom of equal protection under the law, all seem to be only your freedoms and not others.

Learn history before you start to jump up on your soapbox.

Learn history before you condemn others.



The lefties know little about actual history.

The people in the Northern States also owned slaves.
The Africans who sold slaves to the Spanish Traders owned slaves themselves.
The American Flag flew over the slave states for 89 years but you don't hear the lefties calling for the removal of The American Flag.
The so-called "Confederate flag " the lefties hate is not the flag of the Confederacy.
The word Nazi comes from the German Nationalist Socialist Party whose political agenda aligns with that of the Democrat socialists of today.



BrerRabbit - 8/22/2017 at 04:21 PM

quote:
The lefties know little about actual history.

quote:
The people in the Northern States also owned slaves.


Abolished by 1804.

quote:
The Africans who sold slaves to the Spanish Traders owned slaves themselves.


So you are saying blacks are to blame for enslaving themselves. Whites were simply availing themselves of the windfall benefit of an African institution. Thanks for setting the record straight, sensei.

quote:
The American Flag flew over the slave states for 89 years but you don't hear the lefties calling for the removal of The American Flag.


After 89 years every Union flag was removed from the slave states. Took a civil war to put it back up.

quote:
The so-called "Confederate flag " the lefties hate is not the flag of the Confederacy.


It is simply a different design in a group of flags that all mean the same thing.

quote:
The word Nazi comes from the German Nationalist Socialist Party whose political agenda aligns with that of the Democrat socialists of today.


Then why are all your baldhead jackbooted thug pals marching around with Nazi flags? Don't they know it is the emblem of the modern liberal?

Appears the ultrawrong, I mean ultraright doesn't know its history as well. Maybe you should troll their websites too and help them see reason.

[Edited on 8/22/2017 by BrerRabbit]


Jerry - 8/22/2017 at 04:39 PM

quote:
For the record, I want us all to do whatever the hell we want to do without a hostile reaction from our peers. Fly the confederate flag, kneel during the anthem, do whatever you need to do as long as you are not hurting or having an adverse material affect on anyone. No need to agree on it - just have to be civil about it. The problem begins, not with the flag waving or the kneeling, but when the masses on both sides go into hysteria attack mode.


I totally agree with you.


Jerry - 8/22/2017 at 04:42 PM

[




Then why are all your baldhead jackbooted thug pals marching around with Nazi flags? Don't they know it is the emblem of the modern liberal?

[Edited on 8/22/2017 by BrerRabbit]


Really? When did that happen?


BoytonBrother - 8/22/2017 at 06:03 PM

quote:
The word Nazi comes from the German Nationalist Socialist Party whose political agenda aligns with that of the Democrat socialists of today.


You think the neo-nazis voted for Hillary?


jkeller - 8/22/2017 at 06:11 PM

There are a couple of people here who do not understand the difference between socialism and neo socialism. They are not interchangeable.

[Edited on 8/22/2017 by jkeller]


2112 - 8/22/2017 at 07:54 PM

quote:
quote:
The word Nazi comes from the German Nationalist Socialist Party whose political agenda aligns with that of the Democrat socialists of today.


You think the neo-nazis voted for Hillary?


Obviously. Never mind all the red hats.


BrerRabbit - 8/22/2017 at 09:09 PM

quote:
Then why are all your baldhead jackbooted thug pals marching around with Nazi flags? Don't they know it is the emblem of the modern liberal?


quote:
Really? When did that happen?


Really? You have to ask that? Let's just assume you are being deliberately obtuse. Because if not, you are pig ignorant and blind.

Here are images from Charlottesville, clearly showing misguided White Supremacists displaying flags that represent the values of evil liberals.



here is the National Socialist Movement USA flag at Charlottesville, haha dumbsh!ts don't even know they are promoting the Democratic ideal. the NSM also stands for National Socialists Matter:



Maybe Muleman ought to go and have a word with these idiots, teach them all about who the real Nazis are.


Muleman1994 - 8/22/2017 at 09:16 PM

quote:
quote:
The lefties know little about actual history.

quote:
The people in the Northern States also owned slaves.


Abolished by 1804.

quote:
The Africans who sold slaves to the Spanish Traders owned slaves themselves.


So you are saying blacks are to blame for enslaving themselves. Whites were simply availing themselves of the windfall benefit of an African institution. Thanks for setting the record straight, sensei.

quote:
The American Flag flew over the slave states for 89 years but you don't hear the lefties calling for the removal of The American Flag.


After 89 years every Union flag was removed from the slave states. Took a civil war to put it back up.

quote:
The so-called "Confederate flag " the lefties hate is not the flag of the Confederacy.


It is simply a different design in a group of flags that all mean the same thing.

quote:
The word Nazi comes from the German Nationalist Socialist Party whose political agenda aligns with that of the Democrat socialists of today.


Then why are all your baldhead jackbooted thug pals marching around with Nazi flags? Don't they know it is the emblem of the modern liberal?

Appears the ultrawrong, I mean ultraright doesn't know its history as well. Maybe you should troll their websites too and help them see reason.

[Edited on 8/22/2017 by BrerRabbit]



Not even close.
Your public school education is showing again son.
The facts are apolitical in the real world.


BoytonBrother - 8/22/2017 at 10:36 PM

Does Mule really believe the neo-nazis vote Democrat? Amazing!


goldtop - 8/23/2017 at 12:15 AM



Pick one... if you fly it as a part of your heritage you support slavery to this day because they all represent that ideology....not what you want them to represent or how you "feel"

Some very old tired arguments...and ya all got to speak so no suppression of the 1st amendment here...but all I heard was justifications for "feelings" instead of realization of facts and the history of those ideologies

[Edited on 8/23/2017 by goldtop]

[Edited on 8/23/2017 by goldtop]


Jerry - 8/23/2017 at 04:00 AM

quote:
The people in the Northern States also owned slaves.

Abolished by 1804.
___________________________________________________________________________ _____________

Slave ownership lasted until early 1866 in Delaware, Maryland (union state), Kentucky (Union state), actually, before the start of the "Civil War" there were 451,021 slaves held in Northern states. There were only 14 states in the US that officially had no slaves. Lil ole New Jersey even had slaves.
___________________________________________________________________________ _____________
quote:
The Africans who sold slaves to the Spanish Traders owned slaves themselves.


So you are saying blacks are to blame for enslaving themselves. Whites were simply availing themselves of the windfall benefit of an African institution. Thanks for setting the record straight, sensei.
___________________________________________________________________________ _____________
A correction is needed here. Spanish traders dealt mostly in the locals as slaves.
Muslim raiders captured a fair amount, but most were sold from the local chieftain if there wasn't a sustainable food supply, or if they had captured warriors in a local tribal conflict.
The barter was for iron goods and bracelets made of copper called "Manillas".
___________________________________________________________________________ _____________
quote:
The American Flag flew over the slave states for 89 years but you don't hear the lefties calling for the removal of The American Flag.


After 89 years every Union flag was removed from the slave states. Took a civil war to put it back up.

___________________________________________________________________________ _____________

It still flew over slavery for 89 years. Why aren't you calling for it's removal?
___________________________________________________________________________ _____________

quote:
The word Nazi comes from the German Nationalist Socialist Party whose political agenda aligns with that of the Democrat socialists of today.

___________________________________________________________________________ _____________
It was the National Socialist German Workers Party (NSDAP). Ultra right, then turned Facist.



[Edited on 8/22/2017 by BrerRabbit]


BrerRabbit - 8/23/2017 at 05:34 PM

quote:
Why aren't you calling for it's removal?


Good question. And it is absolutely fair that in any debate about flags that scrutiny would fall upon the Union flag as well, as it certainly has its share of dirt.

For the record, I never called for the removal of any flag. If the general consensus is that a flag is distressing then common decency usually prevails in the USA, as I feel it has in the case of the Confederate symbol.

If the Union flag becomes an issue for those with a heritage of oppression associated with that symbol, then I see no reason why it can't be changed. It has changed to reflect our changing country many times.

Perhaps it is time for new flag. Or at least add some symbols to it that honor people who feel left out by its current design. Maybe a medicine wheel to honor Native Americans, some non-Confederate nod to the sacrifice of Southerners both white and black, something for the Chinese who built the West, the Mexicans who got the food from the fields to our plates, and so on.

Which in a way is all moot, as that is exactly what our flag does represent by now, the whole patchwork spectrum of our beautiful, crazy, conflicted, yet free country.

That's the best I can figure on the flag thing.


2112 - 8/23/2017 at 07:58 PM

quote:
quote:
Why aren't you calling for it's removal?


Good question. And it is absolutely fair that in any debate about flags that scrutiny would fall upon the Union flag as well, as it certainly has its share of dirt.

For the record, I never called for the removal of any flag. If the general consensus is that a flag is distressing then common decency usually prevails in the USA, as I feel it has in the case of the Confederate symbol.

If the Union flag becomes an issue for those with a heritage of oppression associated with that symbol, then I see no reason why it can't be changed. It has changed to reflect our changing country many times.

Perhaps it is time for new flag. Or at least add some symbols to it that honor people who feel left out by its current design. Maybe a medicine wheel to honor Native Americans, some non-Confederate nod to the sacrifice of Southerners both white and black, something for the Chinese who built the West, the Mexicans who got the food from the fields to our plates, and so on.

Which in a way is all moot, as that is exactly what our flag does represent by now, the whole patchwork spectrum of our beautiful, crazy, conflicted, yet free country.

That's the best I can figure on the flag thing.


The current US flag has is less than 100 years old. It never flew over the US during a period of slavery, so this whole argument is silly and nothing more than a red herring.


BrerRabbit - 8/24/2017 at 03:53 PM

Hahaha and here I thought I made this great unifying speech, getting all patriotic, with low martial symphonic swells fading in - as the star spangled banner unfurls and ripples against a cerulean sky . . .

But no, just another pointless tack on the Ship of Fools.


Jerry - 8/25/2017 at 03:28 AM

quote:
Hahaha and here I thought I made this great unifying speech, getting all patriotic, with low martial symphonic swells fading in - as the star spangled banner unfurls and ripples against a cerulean sky . . .

But no, just another pointless tack on the Ship of Fools.



2112 is wrong. The US flag was designated on June 14th, 1777. Only the number and placement of the stars have changed as states were add, and for a short period two extra stripes were added.
The flag has been pretty much the same since the Second Continental Congress passed the Flag Resolution.

"Resolved: That the flag of the thirteen united states be thirteen stripes, alternate red and white; that the union be thirteen stars, white on a blue field, representing a new constellation.

Now you know why June 14th is Flag Day.

So BrerRabbit, you did good.


BrerRabbit - 8/25/2017 at 04:00 AM

Thx man, still trying figure where the medicine wheel should go.

Hey, question, what did the two extra stripes stand for?


2112 - 8/25/2017 at 04:59 AM

quote:
quote:
Hahaha and here I thought I made this great unifying speech, getting all patriotic, with low martial symphonic swells fading in - as the star spangled banner unfurls and ripples against a cerulean sky . . .

But no, just another pointless tack on the Ship of Fools.



2112 is wrong. The US flag was designated on June 14th, 1777. Only the number and placement of the stars have changed as states were add, and for a short period two extra stripes were added.
The flag has been pretty much the same since the Second Continental Congress passed the Flag Resolution.

"Resolved: That the flag of the thirteen united states be thirteen stripes, alternate red and white; that the union be thirteen stars, white on a blue field, representing a new constellation.

Now you know why June 14th is Flag Day.

So BrerRabbit, you did good.


Like I said, the current 50 star US flag dates back to 1959. The 50 star flag never flew during a period of slavery. Period! We are not talking about similar flags, we are talking about the current US flag.

I've never heard of a black person complain about the current US flag because of slavery. Have you?


Jerry - 8/25/2017 at 12:39 PM

quote:
Thx man, still trying figure where the medicine wheel should go.

Hey, question, what did the two extra stripes stand for?


The stripes were added when Kentucky and Vermont became states.
They were taken off when other territories became states and it was better to stick with the original 13 rather than add a stripe for each new state, and add the stars.


Jerry - 8/25/2017 at 12:48 PM

quote:
quote:
quote:
Hahaha and here I thought I made this great unifying speech, getting all patriotic, with low martial symphonic swells fading in - as the star spangled banner unfurls and ripples against a cerulean sky . . .

But no, just another pointless tack on the Ship of Fools.



2112 is wrong. The US flag was designated on June 14th, 1777. Only the number and placement of the stars have changed as states were add, and for a short period two extra stripes were added.
The flag has been pretty much the same since the Second Continental Congress passed the Flag Resolution.

"Resolved: That the flag of the thirteen united states be thirteen stripes, alternate red and white; that the union be thirteen stars, white on a blue field, representing a new constellation.

Now you know why June 14th is Flag Day.

So BrerRabbit, you did good.


Like I said, the current 50 star US flag dates back to 1959. The 50 star flag never flew during a period of slavery. Period! We are not talking about similar flags, we are talking about the current US flag.

I've never heard of a black person complain about the current US flag because of slavery. Have you?


I have, and so have you. Many contrasting opinions have been posted on this site about at least one black male for over a year. He also has a few followers.
Do you mean to tell me you don't remember him?


Jerry - 8/27/2017 at 01:49 AM

Calling 2112, where are you?

Have you remembered who I mentioned, or are you as ill informed of current events as you are history?


2112 - 8/27/2017 at 04:10 AM

quote:
Calling 2112, where are you?

Have you remembered who I mentioned, or are you as ill informed of current events as you are history?


Are you referring to Kaepernick? If so I don't think he is protesting the flag because it flew over the US when it was a slavery nation. Instead he is protesting the current injustice to blacks in America. Not exactly the same thing. I understand what he is protesting, although I can't say I agree with his sentiments or methods.


Jerry - 8/27/2017 at 09:18 PM

quote:
quote:
Calling 2112, where are you?

Have you remembered who I mentioned, or are you as ill informed of current events as you are history?


Are you referring to Kaepernick? If so I don't think he is protesting the flag because it flew over the US when it was a slavery nation. Instead he is protesting the current injustice to blacks in America. Not exactly the same thing. I understand what he is protesting, although I can't say I agree with his sentiments or methods.


How quickly we forget:
nfl.com/news/story/0ap3000000691077/article/colin-kaepernick-explains-why-h e-sat-during-national-anthem

"I am not going to stand up to show pride in a flag for a country that oppresses black people and people of color."

You will notice he made the point about protesting the flag.


Bhawk - 9/1/2017 at 02:29 AM

How come Southerners never seem upset that neo nazis and white supremacists use Confederate imagery of any kind? If it's all about honoring heritage, what kind of honor is that?


BrerRabbit - 9/1/2017 at 02:42 AM

Probably don't think about it much? Don't know but I'm sure there are plenty of southern WW2 vets, well were, who would be plenty distressed to see German Nazi symbols displayed by Americans.


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